Canucks prospect Karlsson breaks Pettersson's rookie record in Sweden

[Curmudgeon]

1 hour ago, EternalCanuckFan said:

I haven't looked at his deployment since February but he hasn't been generating many shots during this cold streak.  His ice time has dropped fairly significantly as well.  Curious if it's a factor of the long NHL regular season, higher physicality, etc.  Maybe Dahlen will learn from this season and come back stronger next season.

Since the beginning of December, Dahlen has five goals and four assists. In his last 10 games he has averaged about 11.5 minutes a game, producing one goal and one assist in that time. The long season is likely a factor; in Sweden the season is 52 games long. The difference in physicality from the Swedish leagues is also significant, particularly with bigger players on a smaller ice surface. He's a talented player, but is also -10 over his last ten games, so he needs to play at both ends of the ice to get more ice time.

[vancan2233]

6 hours ago, kloubek said:

That's great and all, but we need to keep in mind he's 22. He's a man playing against men, when Petey was just a boy.

 

Also, let's not fool ourselves - the SHL is not a particularly talented league. Top scorers include the likes of Linus Omark, and others like Rattie who haven't been good enough to stick in the NHL or even the AHL. 

Still, promising news I suppose...

It ranked the 3rd best hockey league in the world only the KHL and NHL are ranked above, while the AHL is ranked 4th. Him playing good in the SHL is more promising then him doing so in the AHL. 

Edited March 23, 2022 by vancan2233

[Junkyard Dog]

5 hours ago, Bure_Pavel said:

Hopefully he can develop into a great third line center. 

He's more of a winger.

[Coconuts]

2 hours ago, PetterssonOrPeterson said:

Could possibly be another silent benning trade win. He's made a few, like the Motte, Granlund and Lammikko deals that ended up benefitting this team.

 

Here's hoping this is another.

I'd def say it's another Benning trade that's aged rather well. 

 

Will Karlsson be an NHL player? Remains to be seen, but considering many saw him as a nothing return for Dahlen it's been quite the turnaround. He's had quite the season. 

[Harold Drunken]

I'm not going to get too ahead of myself on this one, he's a bit of a one year wonder and all scouting reports question his skating ability. Nonetheless this is exciting to hear but let's get him to Abbotsford next year and try and develop him and his skating to an NHL level without rushing him into the lineup.

Edited March 23, 2022 by Harold Drunken

[PetterssonOrPeterson]

2 hours ago, Coconuts said:

I'd def say it's another Benning trade that's aged rather well. 

 

Will Karlsson be an NHL player? Remains to be seen, but considering many saw him as a nothing return for Dahlen it's been quite the turnaround. He's had quite the season. 

Hopefully this is a nice last parting gift from Benning. 

 

He's much bigger and plays more physical than Dahlen is all I knew when we first got him. Looks like he has some scoring ability too. 

 

Good stuff.

[PetterssonOrPeterson]

8 hours ago, Dazzle said:

Just because he broke it at 22, instead of 18 19, doesn't mean he's not going to break out one day. It shows a ton of promise because a ton of SHL men do not score in that league.

I actually wonder why this is the case? I was pretty surprised the record was only 24 goals for a rookie prior to Karlsson breaking it, and obviously Petey who established that record.

 

Is it a super defensive heavy league?

The SHL is obviously not nearly on the same level as the NHL so I was always wondering why there aren't more prolific goal scorers in that league since it seems like it would be easier to get points.

 

 

Edited March 24, 2022 by PetterssonOrPeterson

[ShawnAntoski]

11 hours ago, PetterssonOrPeterson said:

Could possibly be another silent benning trade win. He's made a few, like the Motte, Granlund and Lammikko deals that ended up benefitting this team.

 

Here's hoping this is another.

JB made some good decision - drafting Demko & his extension; and some mistakes or annual mistakes: overpaying for complementary players.  Off the ice, it is his choice of coaches and the baffling Green extension.   In the end, his constant retooling (Aquaman meddling ?), has only made his job hard on himself and his legacy, mired with mediocrity.

Edited March 24, 2022 by ShawnAntoski

[Baggins]

7 hours ago, vancan2233 said:

It ranked the 3rd best hockey league in the world only the KHL and NHL are ranked above, while the AHL is ranked 4th. Him playing good in the SHL is more promising then him doing so in the AHL. 

I'm not so sure about that. The KHL does attract more internation players because it pays better than the SHL. But Linden Vey went over after failing in the NHL and finished third in KHL points. That makes me think it's only a little better than the AHL. Several former Canuck projects are playing well in the KHL. 

[Baggins]

4 hours ago, PetterssonOrPeterson said:

I actually wonder why this is the case? I was pretty surprised the record was only 24 goals for a rookie prior to Karlsson breaking it, and obviously Petey who established that record.

 

Is it a super defensive heavy league?

The SHL is obviously not nearly on the same level as the NHL so I was always wondering why there aren't more prolific goal scorers in that league since it seems like it would be easier to get points.

SHL is a 52 game season. So 24 in 52 converts to 39 goals in 82 games. The SHL is a well coached league imo. 

[24K PureCool]

Never complain about a potential swede for the Canucks! 

[N4ZZY]

I’m not expecting too much out of Karlsson. I’d like him to come to Abbotsford and see what he can do in the AHL. 

 

Someone mentioned the SHL is the third best league in the world, and the AHL the fourth. If he’s producing as well as he does at the SHL level, then he should be able to produce just as much at a lower tiered league, no? 

 

I know it doesn’t always translate that way. But still nice to dream. 

 

Would love Karlsson and McDonaugh to sign with the Canucks and start stocking that AHL franchise in Abby.

 

Too bad we’re striking out on the collegiate level, though. 

 

[filthycanuck]

43 minutes ago, N4ZZY said:

I’m not expecting too much out of Karlsson. I’d like him to come to Abbotsford and see what he can do in the AHL. 

 

Someone mentioned the SHL is the third best league in the world, and the AHL the fourth. If he’s producing as well as he does at the SHL level, then he should be able to produce just as much at a lower tiered league, no? 

 

I know it doesn’t always translate that way. But still nice to dream. 

 

Would love Karlsson and McDonaugh to sign with the Canucks and start stocking that AHL franchise in Abby.

 

Too bad we’re striking out on the collegiate level, though. 

 

Its a nice feather in the cap but hardly moving the needle. If he does get into Abby, Im not too confident about our guys developing there considering the track record. Hopefully JR and PA can fix that. A lot of people thought Lind, Gadj were sure fire NHLers, theyre not. Even all the hype with Aiden McDonough. Its nice that hes doing good in the collegiate level, but lets get real now, he's not remotely as good as Gaudette was, and Gauds is barely holding on to an NHL job

[Baggins]

18 hours ago, kloubek said:

That's great and all, but we need to keep in mind he's 22. He's a man playing against men, when Petey was just a boy.

 

Also, let's not fool ourselves - the SHL is not a particularly talented league. Top scorers include the likes of Linus Omark, and others like Rattie who haven't been good enough to stick in the NHL or even the AHL. 

Still, promising news I suppose...

I'm not as sold on the KHL as most. They get more international players because they pay more. But do you remember Linden Vey failing in the NHL? He went to the KHL in 2017. Take a look at the top 10 scoring leaders, and their age, that season. Vey was one of the three over a ppg in the top 10. 

 

 

[Baggins]

1 hour ago, filthycanuck said:

Its a nice feather in the cap but hardly moving the needle. If he does get into Abby, Im not too confident about our guys developing there considering the track record. Hopefully JR and PA can fix that. A lot of people thought Lind, Gadj were sure fire NHLers, theyre not. Even all the hype with Aiden McDonough. Its nice that hes doing good in the collegiate level, but lets get real now, he's not remotely as good as Gaudette was, and Gauds is barely holding on to an NHL job

You just never really know really know until they get here. Some excel at a level below the NHL but for whatever reason just can't make that next step. Just as some excellent juniors never even make an impact in the AHL. Scouts look for skills and traits but you just never know until they arrive at the next level. For some no amount of coaching will get them any further. Their ability just caps out.

 

One thing I read about Karlsson that should help him advance is he plays an aggressive 200' game at C or wing and also plays both pp and pk. His SHL coach even plays him in the dying minutes holding a one goal lead. Those are good traits to increase his odds of making the jump. According to scouting reports I read he's increased his "expected ceiling" from bottom six in NHL when drafted to middle six now. But prospects don't come with any guarantees. I'm the 'wait and see' type, rather than the 'I expect him on the big club right away' type.

 

I read McDonough is still not a great skater, although he did hire a skating coach this year, and still needs work on his defensive game. Gaudette at least came in a good skater. If McDonough is signed I expect him to start in Abby. Even if the reports on Karlsson are accurate I figure he's 50/50 at best whether he starts in the AHL or NHL. Hoglander certainly surprised me last year.  Again, you just don't know until they arrive.

[IBatch]

2 hours ago, Baggins said:

You just never really know really know until they get here. Some excel at a level below the NHL but for whatever reason just can't make that next step. Just as some excellent juniors never even make an impact in the AHL. Scouts look for skills and traits but you just never know until they arrive at the next level. For some no amount of coaching will get them any further. Their ability just caps out.

 

One thing I read about Karlsson that should help him advance is he plays an aggressive 200' game at C or wing and also plays both pp and pk. His SHL coach even plays him in the dying minutes holding a one goal lead. Those are good traits to increase his odds of making the jump. According to scouting reports I read he's increased his "expected ceiling" from bottom six in NHL when drafted to middle six now. But prospects don't come with any guarantees. I'm the 'wait and see' type, rather than the 'I expect him on the big club right away' type.

 

I read McDonough is still not a great skater, although he did hire a skating coach this year, and still needs work on his defensive game. Gaudette at least came in a good skater. If McDonough is signed I expect him to start in Abby. Even if the reports on Karlsson are accurate I figure he's 50/50 at best whether he starts in the AHL or NHL. Hoglander certainly surprised me last year.  Again, you just don't know until they arrive.

SHL is better then the AHL.   With all the lamenting about our AHL system - most guys never played on that team because we drafted so many Euro's and US players whom developed in other developmental leagues...

[IBatch]

15 hours ago, Coconuts said:

I'd def say it's another Benning trade that's aged rather well. 

 

Will Karlsson be an NHL player? Remains to be seen, but considering many saw him as a nothing return for Dahlen it's been quite the turnaround. He's had quite the season. 

Yes.   Another lesson in how long these things take before we can truly judge a trade or even a signing sometimes.    Who knew Schenn would end up playing top four with QHs this year?   Hamonic was supposed to be that guy ... or that Miller would end up a top ten player in his third season with us.    JB era won't be properly judged for a couple more seasons at least.    

[kloubek]

17 hours ago, vancan2233 said:

It ranked the 3rd best hockey league in the world only the KHL and NHL are ranked above, while the AHL is ranked 4th. Him playing good in the SHL is more promising then him doing so in the AHL. 

I'm sure you are basing that statement on facts you picked up somewhere, though I would personally rank AHL 3rd and SHL 4th - but we're splitting hairs.

Your comment is like saying that Rivian stock price is #2 in the world amongst EV car companies. Which sounds great, until you realize their stock price is $46 a share and the #1 positioned Tesla sells at over $1,000 a share. Sure, it's great for them to be in that position and all, but the fact is that it's nowhere near Tesla level. Similarly, it's a good sign Karlsson is doing well in the SHL - but the competition is not great and I'll personally not get too worked up over him until I see what he can do against NHL-level competition. 

 

As an example, do you remember Bill Sweatt? He played a few games for us early last decade, but couldn't stick in the NHL. Yet, in 2014 when he left for the SHL he ended up 10th in scoring that year.

 

It's not remotely the same level of league.

[Gawdzukes]

22 hours ago, EternalCanuckFan said:

Certainly encouraging signs from Karlsson.  Just going to enjoy seeing Karlsson play in NA and possibly make the jump to the NHL at some point.  He still has a long way to go but considering how muted expectations were when he was acquired, his progression is great to see.

 

Giving up Dahlen at the time wasn't great but, to be fair to the regime at the time, Dahlen also hadn't done enough to guarantee a spot on the Canucks' roster.  He should have probably been given more opportunity, but we can't turn back the clock now.  Dahlen was pretty productive from October to January but has been cold since February.  I haven't looked at his deployment since February but he hasn't been generating many shots during this cold streak.  His ice time has dropped fairly significantly as well.  Curious if it's a factor of the long NHL regular season, higher physicality, etc.  Maybe Dahlen will learn from this season and come back stronger next season.

pffft Dahlen was a whiny goof and deserved absolutely nothing. Glad we traded his whiny ass. It was embarrassing to see him compare himself to Petey and demand cherry playing assignments and time in the NHL. I'd rather lose than bow to a chump like that.

[Gawdzukes]

20 hours ago, Curmudgeon said:

Since the beginning of December, Dahlen has five goals and four assists. In his last 10 games he has averaged about 11.5 minutes a game, producing one goal and one assist in that time. The long season is likely a factor; in Sweden the season is 52 games long. The difference in physicality from the Swedish leagues is also significant, particularly with bigger players on a smaller ice surface. He's a talented player, but is also -10 over his last ten games, so he needs to play at both ends of the ice to get more ice time.