[PGT] Dallas Stars at Vancouver Canucks | Apr. 18, 2022

[CanucksJay]

8 minutes ago, Rabbit said:

 

Great win again!

Demko was solid again!

Schenn was the hero last night, come back next season.

OEL and Myers were the cores with the d-group.

Huges looks quite good.

 

Forwarders:

Broser and Highmore back and both looks good.

Pettersson is the star with great skill.

Podz become more and more mature.

Schenn stepping up can't be understated. 

It squashed any hope Dallas had of amping up the physicality to try clawing back in to the game. Dallas tried to turn the momentum and Schenn snuffed it out pretty quickly. 

Schenn literally neutered their team with one fight. 

It then allowed our guys to continue playing a hard nosed high pressure game. 

 

[CaptKirk888]

29 minutes ago, IBatch said:

Look at the 93 team ....

 

Bure 60

Nedved 38

Linden 33

Courtnall 31

Ronning 29

Adams 25 (in 53 games)

Ward  22 (70 games)

Momesso 18...

 

Thats why it's the team that scored 343 or so goals and set the high bar.   Not many teams break 300 anymore.   Both Naslunds and Peak Sedin era could to manage much more then 280...

And with that season and lineup you would expected a good playoff run, even cup contention. Alas Gretzky, Kurri and a very good LA team would end that. Then we have a down year in 93-94 and go to the final, go figure...

[HKSR]

4 minutes ago, CanucksJay said:

Schenn stepping up can't be understated. 

It squashed any hope Dallas had of amping up the physicality to try clawing back in to the game. Dallas tried to turn the momentum and Schenn snuffed it out pretty quickly. 

Schenn literally neutered their team with one fight. 

It then allowed our guys to continue playing a hard nosed high pressure game. 

 

Yeah, Schenn was the MVP last night for sure.

[Guest]

1 hour ago, -Vintage Canuck- said:

26 years ago:

 

Alex Mogilny: 55
Trevor Linden: 33
Martin Gelinas: 30

That year I sent a letter to Vancouver Canucks with three Alex Mogilny hockey cards. He signed them and I received them back in mail. 

 

 

[Guest]

33 minutes ago, HKSR said:

Trading Miller right now would be like trading Courtnall or Adams... 29 or 30 year old guys with a ton of heart, and skill to back it up.

A part of me is holding out hope that JT is offered an 8 mil, 8 year contract and puts pen to paper. Cap is going to be around 100 mil by the time we're in the last two years of that deal. 

 

[EternalCanuckFan]

33 minutes ago, AlphaNuck said:

Seeing how this basically bennings team still, makes you wonder if it has him going WTF 

It makes Benning's presumed reluctance to fire Green all the more odd.  I wasn't necessarily surprised at the firing of Benning and Weisbrod, but I thought Green and his staff would get canned first.  I'm not trying to bash Green but it was becoming more and more clear that the players weren't responding to him and his staff.

[Boudrias]

21 minutes ago, HKSR said:

Yeah, Schenn was the MVP last night for sure.

He definitely was. Also kudo to Dermott for playing a reliable game. Just imagine if Burroughs had dressed. I can see why Beaudreau likes Hunt. He gets trapped at times in his own zone but can move the puck and has an offensive upside. 

[Gawdzukes]

1 hour ago, Kragar said:

 

Doesn't take long to see a number of people pissed about the trade.

lol even the first page is filled with the usual garbage posters posting non-sensical garbage

[CanucksJay]

1 hour ago, HKSR said:

I doubt we'll agree on it, so I'll make my point and move on lol...

 

I think the biggest issue early in the season was the defensive structure (or systems) that the coach had the Canucks playing.  It was clear, the mantra was to try and collapse into the defensive zone and do their best to keep shots to the outside.  Problem was they gave up the blueline so easily and were constantly defending that they couldn't muster any offence after all that zone time defending.  That is a coaching thing.  The PK was the same.  It was a very passive defensive system that invited teams to enter the zone.  With coach BB, the defence begins at the opposing team's blueline.  A huge difference.

This is 100 percent truth. BB even came out and said he always enjoyed being the aggressor and pressuring the other team rather than being the one pressured. Same goes for the PK. that's why guys like Petey are now on the PK. the guys in the NHL are too good when you give them time and space. That's why even when we had a passive box on the PK, we weren't only allowing shots from the perimeter, we were also getting exposed on cross seam passes (which theoretically shouldn't happen) when 4 guys are in tight box but that's what passive play gets you in this league. Historically low pk numbers under TG. 

Bang on regarding the difference in stepping up at the opposing Blue line on defence rather than allowing an easy entry into our zone and going into a shell as if it was a pk. 

Total amateur... 

Schmidt looked like the biggest bone head when he came because he was the only one stepping up at the blue line. There was no back pressure from our forwards to double team their forward on their exit. 

I haven't looked at numbers but I believe this style of play also leads to less injuries on defence as we're not hemmed in taking big hits and blocking shots the entire game. 

I bet Schmidt would look like the guy JB thought he was getting if he was playing under BB. Perfect for BB's system. 

 

 

[Goal:thecup]

1 minute ago, Boudrias said:

He definitely was. Also kudo to Dermott for playing a reliable game. Just imagine if Burroughs had dressed. I can see why Beaudreau likes Hunt. He gets trapped at times in his own zone but can move the puck and has an offensive upside. 

Dermott had another nice game; solid pickup by new mngt.

 

[tas]

57 minutes ago, IBatch said:

Look at the 93 team ....

 

Bure 60

Nedved 38

Linden 33

Courtnall 31

Ronning 29

Adams 25 (in 53 games)

Ward  22 (70 games)

Momesso 18...

 

Thats why it's the team that scored 343 or so goals and set the high bar.   Not many teams break 300 anymore.   Both Naslunds and Peak Sedin era could to manage much more then 280...

it's a different game. that year, there were 21 different players over 100 points and 10 of them had 123 or more. bure's 60 goals were only good enough for 5th -- two guys with 76 and mario with 69 in 60 games (a pace that exactly matches gretzky's 92 goal season).

 

pre-buttefly goalies were exciting to watch, but compared to even the worst goalie in the league now, they were sieves. 

[Guest]

5 minutes ago, EternalCanuckFan said:

It makes Benning's presumed reluctance to fire Green all the more odd.  I wasn't necessarily surprised at the firing of Benning and Weisbrod, but I thought Green and his staff would get canned first.  I'm not trying to bash Green but it was becoming more and more clear that the players weren't responding to him and his staff.

The initial problem was the fact that all money was frozen right after the bubble. Green had earned an extension but Aqua didn't want anyone extended that summer and in fact they laid off quite a bit of the GM Place/Rogers Arena staff. 

 

Green should've been given an extension right then and there as after that disastrous year he couldve been let go and we would've had a clean slate for this year. 

 

This is all with the benefit of hindsight, but the coaching decisions in the last year and a half were out of Benning's hands. It was widely reported that Benning wasn't given autonomy to make a coaching change this year. It makes sense too once you consider that he was let go along with Weisbrod. 

 

My glass is half full self believes that even if we miss the playoffs this year (most likely scenario), we will get a good player at 15th-16th overall and that our management will have more of a free reign to put their stamp on the team without the pressure of messing with a playoff team. 

[MikeyD]

6 minutes ago, HKSR said:

 

Yup, keep pushing forward.  The last thing this team needs is to gut it by taking a guy like Miller out of the lineup and dressing room.  It would piss off the guys on the roster to no end.  Imagine how Petey, Bo, Demko, and others would feel if Miller was traded now after they've been playing .600+ hockey for months with the new coach. 

 

I really hope Dickinson keeps improving, not so that we keep him, but rather so we can trade him for something.  Then move Poolman, and we can add a Top 4 quality RHD through UFA.  The forward group does NOT need work.  When healthy, the forwards are:

 

Garland-Miller-Podkolzin

Hoglander-Petey-Boeser

Pearson-Bo-Chiasson

Highmore-Lamikko-Lockwood

 

That is very solid depth. 

 

Three 30 goal scoring centres... how much more depth do you need?

Heading into the season everybody assumed the scoring would be easy for this team considering the depth that was there. Some people expected Podkolzin to be better earlier in the season, closer to how he is playing now. I predicted a 40 point season, but that was definitely lower than most peoples estimations. It took him even longer than I thought to figure it out. I was really really concerned about his play earlier in the year. But I suppose that's expected with a language barrier. I underestimated how big of a hurdle that is especially when you combine it with the discomfort of being a rookie and not wanting to overstep your presence in the locker room as well. 

 

Hoglander I still think is capable of being a Garland lite as well. He was starting to figure it out again too before he got injured. Those two players alone with the addition of Garland would have made a nice forward crew.

 

I'd still like another third line player that can supply points. Like another Pearson type player. 

[Maniwaki Canuck]

3 hours ago, HKSR said:

That's what the goal song should be changed to if coach BB is extended.  Would be annoying for other teams to hear 'Whoomp (Bruce) There It Is' 6 or7 times in a game lol

 

And the bass from that song would rock the arena all night long haha

 

It almost already is our goal song, at least as far as the crowd goes.  I love it as something uniquely ours and the anthem of this team's resurrection and gutsy play under Bruce. 

Then there's that derivative Atlanta Braves "ohhhhh-oh-oh" stuff that needed to end before it ever got started here.  Such an embarrassment, especially now that we've got something so much better.

[Kragar]

56 minutes ago, Gawdzukes said:

lol even the first page is filled with the usual garbage posters posting non-sensical garbage

Yeah, some of those complainers I tend to ignore on a regular basis.

[IBatch]

1 hour ago, tas said:

it's a different game. that year, there were 21 different players over 100 points and 10 of them had 123 or more. bure's 60 goals were only good enough for 5th -- two guys with 76 and mario with 69 in 60 games (a pace that exactly matches gretzky's 92 goal season).

 

pre-buttefly goalies were exciting to watch, but compared to even the worst goalie in the league now, they were sieves. 

 

 

Ten guys scored 100 or more .... Wayne's last season at 33 leading the league.  Federov best year 120 and Wayne at 130 - on a terrible LA team. 

 

 

Yes it sure was.   Talent level is just starting to amp up again.   Unlike the 2000's where the guys who were part of those 10 guy crew in their early 20's were still in the top ten or leading the league in scoring in their 30's.   Sakic had his last 100 point season at 37 in the mid-late 2000's ... Jagr, Sundin, Kariya, Selanne, Pronger, Niedermayer, Lidstrom etc.   Was a really weak decade , same with the 2010's...league bloating from 21-24 teams to 32 for sure didn't help with that.     

 

Edit:  Redline , with guys draping on their backs ... hooked and held at every turn.    It sure was a different era.    And if you want to even up save percentages it still holds up.   What's 4-7% difference really?  Even 10% which of course it is not.    The 90's dead puck era...started after the shortened season.  93/94 was the last high scoring year.   Iginla couldn't do it in the 90's but was one of the leagues best players in the 2000's.    Francis also scored over 100 in his 30's ... so did Jagr.   Forsberg straddled both decades.    Zubov scored 73ish points after the lockout at 37 years old.    Those guys would of had an absolute hey day with the rules and the way the game is called today.   Not like the goalies were that bad.  

 

Edit:  If Miller and all the guys ahead of them score 100...this will be the first season since then it was managed ... nice that talent is finally getting back to that point.  Still has a ways to go though.   

Edited April 19, 2022 by IBatch

[Frozen Water Walker]

As Petey gets better so does the team, wonder where all the "lets trade this guy" people are now?

[tas]

59 minutes ago, IBatch said:

 

 

Ten guys scored 100 or more .... Wayne's last season at 33 leading the league.  Federov best year 120 and Wayne at 130 - on a terrible LA team. 

 

 

Yes it sure was.   Talent level is just starting to amp up again.   Unlike the 2000's where the guys who were part of those 10 guy crew in their early 20's were still in the top ten or leading the league in scoring in their 30's.   Sakic had his last 100 point season at 37 in the mid-late 2000's ... Jagr, Sundin, Kariya, Selanne, Pronger, Niedermayer, Lidstrom etc.   Was a really weak decade , same with the 2010's...league bloating from 21-24 teams to 32 for sure didn't help with that.     

 

Edit:  Redline , with guys draping on their backs ... hooked and held at every turn.    It sure was a different era.    And if you want to even up save percentages it still holds up.   What's 4-7% difference really?  Even 10% which of course it is not.    The 90's dead puck era...started after the shortened season.  93/94 was the last high scoring year.   Iginla couldn't do it in the 90's but was one of the leagues best players in the 2000's.    Francis also scored over 100 in his 30's ... so did Jagr.   Forsberg straddled both decades.    Zubov scored 73ish points after the lockout at 37 years old.    Those guys would of had an absolute hey day with the rules and the way the game is called today.   Not like the goalies were that bad.  

 

Edit:  If Miller and all the guys ahead of them score 100...this will be the first season since then it was managed ... nice that talent is finally getting back to that point.  Still has a ways to go though.   

the stats you mentioned and that I quoted are from 92-93, which is what I thought we were talking about. gretzky as leading scorer with ten 100 point guys was 93-94.

 

edit: also, the talent level now is by far the best it's ever been, but there is far less disparity between the best players and the worst. teams now would blow early 90s teams out of the water. 

Edited April 19, 2022 by tas

[IBatch]

1 hour ago, tas said:

the stats you mentioned and that I quoted are from 92-93, which is what I thought we were talking about. gretzky as leading scorer with ten 100 point guys was 93-94.

 

edit: also, the talent level now is by far the best it's ever been, but there is far less disparity between the best players and the worst. teams now would blow early 90s teams out of the water. 

I get it.   But no i don't think it's the best we've ever seen.  The league has bloated itself for a very long time.  If a 37 year old Sakic, can beat out a Sedin in his prime ... i'm sorry i just don't see it.   And put EP back into the 90's or Brock or anyone but maybe Podz, Horvat and Miller - they'd just be crushed.    They were crushed.   Unless you were otherworldly like Mogilny, Bure, Federov etc - you couldn't make do.   How good was Iginla in the 90's?  It's not hard to trace it back.   Sorry Tas i disagree.   Talent was better back then.   It's never just been about skating. 

Edited April 19, 2022 by IBatch

[tas]

13 minutes ago, IBatch said:

I get it.   But no i don't think it's the best we've ever seen.  The league has bloated itself for a very long time.  If a 37 year old Sakic, can beat out a Sedin in his prime ... i'm sorry i just don't see it.   And put EP back into the 90's or Brock or anyone but maybe Podz, Horvat and Miller - they'd just be crushed.    They were crushed.   Unless you were otherworldly like Mogilny, Bure, Federov etc - you couldn't make do.   How good was Iginla in the 90's?  It's not hard to trace it back.   Sorry Tas i disagree.   Talent was better back then.   It's never just been about skating. 

skating and puck skills are universally superior now. just because guys were allowed to destroy and impede others back then unfettered doesn't mean the talent level was higher. did players need to be tougher? sure. but the talent level is by far better now.