[Trade] Canucks trade Bo Horvat to Islanders for Anthony Beauvillier, Aatu Raty, 2023 1st-round draft pick

[EdgarM]

56 minutes ago, coryberg said:

Game 7 of the stanley cup finals has only happened twice in over 50 years. One of those were with the twins... I'd say that's our most successful playoffs.

No, if that Captain is Linden or Smyl? we do win the Cup in 2011 IMO. With the team that was assembled for the Twins, I expected a lot more playoff success and certainly at least one Cup. How many times did we win the Presidents Cup? 

We were not dominant in the playoffs with Nazzy or Hank. 

Twice in 50 years just proves how bad we have been, is all, in building a Championship team.

[JeremyCuddles]

4 minutes ago, Strawbone said:

Can we get back to playing hockey? All-star week is booooooring! I'm itching for some real hockey again. I'm so curious to see what this team looks like after the coaching change and without our long-time captain. Quite possibly like garbage, but a part of me thinks that other guys are really going to step up now and get this team on an upward trajectory. No matter what, with our AHL goaltending and porous defense we will lose enough games to stay in the hunt for a top-5 pick.

Abbotsford Canucks are playing tonight

[EdgarM]

1 hour ago, Ghostsof1915 said:

Disagree we lost 1994 in game 7 by a single goal. Game 7 with the twins we got shelled that game.

Yes and Linden scored 2 goals in that game with broken ribs among other injuries. Game 7 in 2011 was pathetic , that game was over before it started and I don't think I even watched the whole thing.

[RUPERTKBD]

1 hour ago, Ghostsof1915 said:

Disagree we lost 1994 in game 7 by a single goal. Game 7 with the twins we got shelled that game.

The '94 team was relatively healthy. The walking wounded on the 2011 team included Hank, Kes, Ehrhoff, Bieksa and Raymond. They were playing without their top LD and their best faceoff guy.....

 

Meanwhile they were facing a goaltender with .115 GAA and a .967 SV% ...... In comparison, Mike Richter threw up a decent .213 GAA and a respectable SV% of .911

 

The '94 Canucks were a good team that got hot at the right time and went on a deep run. The 2011 Canucks were a great team that were too beat up to close the deal. Breaking it down to "This game 7 was closer than that game 7" is a poor way to compare the two teams, IMHO....

[Gawdzukes]

2 hours ago, ilduce39 said:

As fun as it is to predict a lottery win next year with the Isles’ pick, I’ll be very happy with a 13-17 pick this year. 

Yup me too. Super stoked with this trade as I've been on board for acquiring the best players we can, even if a little patience and a step back is required. You can do that in trade sometimes but in our situation we should 100% be supplementing with draft prospects as we need lots of options. We've been spinning our wheels so long anyway it doesn't even bother me in the least if we're not overly competitive next year. The following year is where we should be focusing on rounding out our team and have a solid plan in place for a RD or two. One good RD to pair with Hughes as they play the majority of minutes could also hugely benefit OEL, and transform our D immediately into a strength.

 

The 2023 draft thread is very interesting. Some of the smarter guys like @Isam are not very high on Reichenbach, and Dragicevic, but I really like Reichenbach, and would be super stocked to get him. Same with really any of the higher touted RD. However, if they go another route there will be a lot of other very good players available. Hopefully we don't take any tiny wingers though.

[CanucksJay]

21 minutes ago, EdgarM said:

I agree to a point. Beagle and Rousel started out well but they also softened up as time went by. Did the coach have anything to do with that? I believe the coach and the whole team need to have that pack mentality to make it work. 

But yeah, eliminating the soft players is the main priority but you still need that veteran presence like Schenn.

Yeah I definitely want a team with that pack mentality.

I wouldn't give Schenn away but I think a second might be worth it. 

 

Although I heard his wife is expecting... Maybe the humane thing to do is to let him be and re-sign him as he's been a soldier for us. 

Who knows, maybe we get more respect from him if we ask him what he wants. 

Does he want a shot with a contender and come back to Vancouver after or does he want to stay here and let him call the shots. 

 

[EdgarM]

57 minutes ago, PhillipBlunt said:

11 years of complete futility and mediocrity. 

We have spent all this time trying to recreate that 2011 team, what a complete waste of time. Was LE the worst part of it? 

[Ghostsof1915]

Just now, EdgarM said:

We have spent all this time trying to recreate that 2011 team, what a complete waste of time. Was LE the worst part of it? 

LE was a bad move. To be fair didn't he light it up playing with the Twins in the Worlds? Benning got bamboozled. And it wouldn't be the first time.

[EdgarM]

55 minutes ago, Odd. said:

It was a very low scoring series for us. We had I think 4 or 5 goals in the entire series. Boston had 4 blowout victories if I can recall.

 

Goaltending was a huge problem for us that series. Would have been nice to score more goals, but man our goaltending was questionable. If they scored 1 goal, it was over. Luongo would get rattled and play with no confidence the rest of the game. 

I think our PP, which was lethal in the regular season, disappeared as well. All those punches to Daniels head were all for nothing I guess. 

[RWJC]

12 minutes ago, CanucksJay said:

Do they have more assets to allow them to beef up? 

 

This would be like the canucks buying. 

 

Theoretically if we wanted to gamble and go all in, we could have retained on Boeser and traded him for a 2nd, re-signed Horvat, traded Garland, trade our 2023 first and 3rd rounder for a bonafide top pairing RHD, package up Myers with a 2nd (from the Boeser trade) and traded him to create cap space and signed Livingstone and Severson this summer and run a team next year that looked like

 

Kuz Petterson Mik 

Pearson Horvat Miller 

Hogz Aman Podz 

Studnicka Lazar  Joshua 

Lockwood

 

Hughes RHD (from 1st and 3rd rounder) 

OEL Severson 

Bear Livingstone

Dermott 

 

Demko

 

I would personally take that team over the Islansers team and we've depleted the same amount of assets

 

So would I, but Lou might be on the hot seat in NYI soon and I can envision him pulling a Benning and trying to make something out of their current roster rather than tear it apart too much. 
They do have multiple assets they could still move…I think the crux is what is someone willing to give up for them in terms of their own need and is that an upgrade for NYI?
 

[Boudrias]

2 hours ago, NUCKER67 said:

Canucks may have just traded their nicest, most kind, gentle human on the team. This, after they let go the nicest, most kind, gentle human coach, maybe ever.

 

So, now they can actually build a fast, physical, aggressive playoff team.  Successful playoff teams need players who will do what it takes to win, a little bit of nasty and fight in them. I don't think Horvat fits this mold.

 

 

Bo played 23 playoff games for the Canucks. 0.70 ppg during playoffs. The team made playoffs only 2 seasons of his 8 years here. I can easily understand why PA was hesitating over a big payday for Bo. If he reverts to mean then his contract would be a big problem. Obviously a quality person. 

[Harold Drunken]

1 hour ago, CanucksJay said:

Im a Benning fan. 

The core is currently Benning's core. 

We don't know what he would have done at the deadline last year. 

 

What if he flipped Miller and then re-signed Boeser to a 1 year QO? 

What if he flipped Horvat for something similar to what Rutherford had done and rebuilt around Hughes and Petey. 

 

We don't know what would have happened. What we do know is that thr last 2 big problems was on Rutherford and co. (Miller and Boeser) 

 

Im glad the Horvat situation worked out. 

 

Also we don't know how much ownership meddled during Benning tenure. 

Virtanen pick by all rumours was Aquaman. The retool idea when we had an empty cupboard was Aquaman. It even made linden quit. 

 

Anyway I'm a Canuck fan first and foremost. I don't need Benning to look like a hero or better GM than Allvin. I just want a winning team so I will cheer on this regime as well and hope they continue to make some good moves because we are at an absolute critical juncture. 

 

 

 

I hear ya, there's obviously a lot of what if's but that works on both sides too. We're one year into the new regime, the previous had 7. The what if they do this what if they do that can also be pointed out here. The core is Benning's core, but the core has done nothing to date. They haven't won anything of note, besides a few bubble playoff games with a goalie playing out of his mind. I know that with a better surrounding cast they could probably do more, but Benning failed at that also. IMO the teams issue isn't talent, it's leadership and identity...which would make sense why paying your current captain huge long term money may not have been the right choice.

 

I too am very suspicious of ownership still pulling the strings, this all seems awfully reminiscent of the previous playbook. I think this Horvat trade kicks things off in the right direction. Possibly having two picks in the top 15 this year is absolutely huge and they have to get it right. I will still give Allvin the benefit of the doubt as he inherited an incredibly tough situation to solve, and let's be honest hasn't had a lot of time to fix it. 1 year in the NHL management world isn't very much. Especially when part of the problem is bad, long term contracts they didn't sign. I don't see the Boeser contract as that big of a deal, it's not as unmovable as OEL and Myers.....more teams will/do want Boeser than those two. They chose Miller over Bo...time will tell if that was the right call....Bo could have been a Canuck for life but chose the money instead, and that's him and his familys right and business at the end of the day.

 

 

Edited February 1, 2023 by Harold Drunken

[EdgarM]

56 minutes ago, Junkyard Dog said:

Compared to other timeframes yeah without question. We made playoffs every but 2 years while Hank and Nas were captains. 
 

We barely managed to have the same success outside this timeframe and have more seasons under .500 than we do above as well. 

Coincidentally their Captaincies fell under the time we had the Cap salaries, before that , we couldn't afford to keep up with the Rangers and other big American cities in those days.

94' just showed what they were able to accomplish with what they had. The NYR's were one the best teams money could buy in those days.

[PhillipBlunt]

7 minutes ago, Ghostsof1915 said:

LE was a bad move. To be fair didn't he light it up playing with the Twins in the Worlds? Benning got bamboozled. And it wouldn't be the first time.

I think Benning was constantly in a state of bamboozlement. 

[CanucksJay]

4 minutes ago, Harold Drunken said:

I hear ya, there's obviously a lot of what if's but that works on both sides too. We're one year into the new regime, the previous had 7. The what if they do this what if they do that can also be pointed out here. The core is Benning's core, but the core has done nothing to date. They haven't won anything of note, besides a few bubble playoff games with a goalie playing out of his mind. I know that with a better surrounding cast they could probably do more, but Benning failed at that also. 

 

I too am very suspicious of ownership still pulling the strings, this all seems awfully reminiscent of the previous playbook. I think this Horvat trade kicks things off in the right direction. Possibly having two picks in the top 15 this year is absolutely huge and they have to get it right. I will still give Allvin the benefit of the doubt as he inherited an incredibly tough situation to solve, and let's be honest hasn't had a lot of time to fix it. 1 year in the NHL management world isn't very much. Especially when part of the problem is bad, long term contracts they didn't sign. I don't see the Boeser contract as that big of a deal, it's not as unmovable as OEL and Myers.....more teams will/do want Boeser than those two. They chose Miller over Bo...time will tell if that was the right call....Bo could have been a Canuck for life but chose the money instead, and that's him and his familys right and business at the end of the day.

 

 

Well said. 

As a fan, I'm really hoping we made the right call with Miller over Horvat. We will soon find out. 

 

[EdgarM]

46 minutes ago, RUPERTKBD said:

I'm certainly not against keeping him, but I think management will move him if they can get anything of value.

One the main priorities for management is changing the culture, so it would have to be a significant return if they did.

[Isam]

6 minutes ago, Gawdzukes said:

Yup me too. Super stoked with this trade as I've been on board for acquiring the best players we can, even if a little patience and a step back is required. You can do that in trade sometimes but in our situation we should 100% be supplementing with draft prospects as we need lots of options. We've been spinning our wheels so long anyway it doesn't even bother me in the least if we're not overly competitive next year. The following year is where we should be focusing on rounding out our team and have a solid plan in place for a RD or two. One good RD to pair with Hughes as they play the majority of minutes could also hugely benefit OEL, and transform our D immediately into a strength.

 

The 2023 draft thread is very interesting. Some of the smarter guys like @Isam are not very high on Reichenbach, and Dragicevic, but I really like Reichenbach, and would be super stocked to get him. Same with really any of the higher touted RD. However, if they go another route there will be a lot of other very good players available. Hopefully we don't take any tiny wingers though.

Not that I am not high on him. He needs alot of work on his gap control and positioning much like bahl and doesnt really deserve his first round grade.  Early second round then yeah. With these two picks right now, we should be focusing in on a crazy forward class. Dmen that I would be focusing on are simashev and minnetian with later picks.

[MaxVerstappen33]

Brain Lawton said on the Bob Mccowen podcast that Newport was asking for 9 million for Bo Horvat. 

[Slegr]

2 hours ago, Ghostsof1915 said:

So was Bo a part of the country club mentality?

He did seem pretty chummy with this guy

[RUPERTKBD]

6 minutes ago, EdgarM said:

One the main priorities for management is changing the culture, so it would have to be a significant return if they did.

I don't know....As much as I like Schenn, he was part of the culture. My guess is that a 2nd will get it done. Maybe a 3rd.

 

If management likes him that much, they can always take a run at signing him again in the off season.