Nikita Tryamkin | D

[Boudrias]

3 hours ago, Hairy Kneel said:

Maybe we can buy him out of the remainder of his Automobilist contract after the olympics ...has that ever been done before? Buyout a KHL contract?

I have never heard whether Tryamkin has a 'opt out' clause in his KHL contract for a possible return to the NHL before his 3 year contract expires. Many such clauses in KHL contracts. His agent would have been a fool not to have insisted on that option. He will always be an attractive prospect because of his size but his position on the depth chart for Vancouver very likely deteriorates over time.  

 

Tryamkin's NHL rights could become a chip for Benning to deal in the future.

Edited August 27, 2017 by Boudrias
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[Hairy Kneel]

2 hours ago, Boudrias said:

I have never heard whether Tryamkin has a 'opt out' clause in his KHL contract for a possible return to the NHL before his 3 year contract expires. Many such clauses in KHL contracts. His agent would have been a fool not to have insisted on that option. He will always be an attractive prospect because of his size but his position on the depth chart for Vancouver very likely deteriorates over time.  

 

Tryamkin's NHL rights could become a chip for Benning to deal in the future.

With more experience and a good olympics I'm sure his value would just keep increasing.

Nevertheless, I'd much rather keep him.

[Nuxfanabroad]

5 hours ago, Rollieo Del Fuego said:

That used to be the "norm" here....before kids got smart and refused to grow up and leave home....

Don't forget exponential taxing with stagnant wages. I don't blame today's youth for the current society we've seen evolve.

 

I wouldn't want to be in my teens/twentys today.

[Rollieo Del Fuego]

1 hour ago, Nuxfanabroad said:

Don't forget exponential taxing with stagnant wages. I don't blame today's youth for the current society we've seen evolve.

 

I wouldn't want to be in my teens/twentys today.

That's true....only the Pro sports people are better off now....the world is in a desperate situation....as usual....just from mounting sides...including the Old WW3 one.

 

World politics in the Tryamkin thread...sort of fits.

 

I hope we can coax him back soon, we don't have a replacement unless Pedan suddenly "gets it".

[alfstonker]

On 8/26/2017 at 6:11 PM, janisahockeynut said:

I posted on you quote Boudrias, but CC and Alfstonker  all made good points.....I had no idea about his wife's English, but to say what I have heard via radio and some posters, so I am bad for that reference...........

 

But the point I am getting to is that, it just appeared that The Canucks did not have a good game plan going into their development of Tryamkin......this is a kid who, probably had a lot of fears coming to a strange country and strange league, to play with the world's best, including knowing his fears of being sent down, which I think he addressed when he declined to go down to the AHL

 

In his country that may mean something entirely different, and there might not be a lot of trust, when they are given promises like that there....was the contract a 2 way, and was he going to receive less money for going down....what was Benning.s contract offer?

 

I think there are a lot of different personalities and circumstances involved and they could have done better.....my gut feeling.......

 

I did not like seeing him go, but don't blame him.....I am just worried that when we get him back, if ever, he hasn't developed.....we will see

 

 

Firstly I think Tryamkin is a lot more savvy than he liked to give out. Insisting on an interpreter all the time when some of the players hinted his English was coming along. I recall when he was in his first season I alluded to him being possible club captain material, purely because his conviction was so strong and he seemed to know his own mind and didn't mind stating it.

 

Also with regard to the AHL I got a completely different impression. 

His wish to stay in the NHL was never questioned contractually imo because I understood it was a condition to coming over that he would not have to play in the AHL. However when it was discovered he was so badly out of condition I said at the time I was surprised his state of fitness was not made part of the condition that he would not go to the AHL.

When the Canucks realised what state he was in, I think they genuinely only suggested he go to the AHL for a spell as a way of helping him - he on the other hand seemed to view it as some kind of breach to what was agreed. That attitude of suspicion (imo) was another factor indicating a pretty savvy hard nosed individual.

[Boudrias]

1 hour ago, alfstonker said:

Firstly I think Tryamkin is a lot more savvy than he liked to give out. Insisting on an interpreter all the time when some of the players hinted his English was coming along. I recall when he was in his first season I alluded to him being possible club captain material, purely because his conviction was so strong and he seemed to know his own mind and didn't mind stating it.

 

Also with regard to the AHL I got a completely different impression. 

His wish to stay in the NHL was never questioned contractually imo because I understood it was a condition to coming over that he would not have to play in the AHL. However when it was discovered he was so badly out of condition I said at the time I was surprised his state of fitness was not made part of the condition that he would not go to the AHL.

When the Canucks realised what state he was in, I think they genuinely only suggested he go to the AHL for a spell as a way of helping him - he on the other hand seemed to view it as some kind of breach to what was agreed. That attitude of suspicion (imo) was another factor indicating a pretty savvy hard nosed individual.

Who comes to a NHL camp not fit? Tryamkin had already played what, 3 seasons of KHL? That whole scenario never made sense to me. Did Tryamkin think he was in KHL shape and thusly in NHL shape? By all reports he shed the weight quickly which implys he knew he was not in shape.  

[J.I.A.H.N]

5 hours ago, alfstonker said:

Firstly I think Tryamkin is a lot more savvy than he liked to give out. Insisting on an interpreter all the time when some of the players hinted his English was coming along. I recall when he was in his first season I alluded to him being possible club captain material, purely because his conviction was so strong and he seemed to know his own mind and didn't mind stating it.

 

Also with regard to the AHL I got a completely different impression. 

His wish to stay in the NHL was never questioned contractually imo because I understood it was a condition to coming over that he would not have to play in the AHL. However when it was discovered he was so badly out of condition I said at the time I was surprised his state of fitness was not made part of the condition that he would not go to the AHL.

When the Canucks realised what state he was in, I think they genuinely only suggested he go to the AHL for a spell as a way of helping him - he on the other hand seemed to view it as some kind of breach to what was agreed. That attitude of suspicion (imo) was another factor indicating a pretty savvy hard nosed individual.

Again  both you and Bourdain make good points and I agree he wasn't  in good shape.....but I think he was still playing as good as other despite his condition........also on the contract issue.......I totally think that it depends on your interpretation  of what good faith is.....for some it is a deal is a deal.....others think it is flexible....If I was a 3 year KHL vet, and found myself knowing I was better than some even though I was out of shape...I may just say nyet....and thanks I will play myself into shape...which is what he did, and to my recollection, he didn't take that long, all the while handling himself as good as anyone not named Tanev.

 

Let me ask you guys a question....Maybe I am out to lunch....but did he look any worse than Hutton or Edler....Really?  If he was there at the beginning, he sure fixed himself quick?

 

If at the end of last season the question was who do you keep Hutton or Tryamkin which would you Take?  And I like Hutton...

[Rob_Zepp]

It seems the further away from end of last season, the more legendary this player becomes.   If he doesn't return to NHL, in three or four years it will be "Norris lock Tryamkin was forced from NHL" and similar.    Kid had some upside but he is neither a lock for Olympic team (even without NHL players going), was developing fine but still had a lot to learn about NHL game and may never have "learned it", and clearly he had some other issues in his head which he feels he could better handle in Russia which doesn't make him as focused as you would like.    This wasn't Bobby Orr everyone - he was a nice find in the third round that had a decent shot at becoming an everyday NHL player but was not the second coming of anyone.   

[Nuxfanabroad]

1 hour ago, Rob_Zepp said:

It seems the further away from end of last season, the more legendary this player becomes.   If he doesn't return to NHL, in three or four years it will be "Norris lock Tryamkin was forced from NHL" and similar.    Kid had some upside but he is neither a lock for Olympic team (even without NHL players going), was developing fine but still had a lot to learn about NHL game and may never have "learned it", and clearly he had some other issues in his head which he feels he could better handle in Russia which doesn't make him as focused as you would like.    This wasn't Bobby Orr everyone - he was a nice find in the third round that had a decent shot at becoming an everyday NHL player but was not the second coming of anyone.   

Still see him as a great ingredient to add, after the team 'turns the corner' to become a younger, rising force.

 

There's no reason Try can't keep developing where he is, as the Canucks do the same. Then 1.5 to 2 yrs later, perhaps the timing could fit nicely.

[alfstonker]

9 hours ago, Boudrias said:

Who comes to a NHL camp not fit? Tryamkin had already played what, 3 seasons of KHL? That whole scenario never made sense to me. Did Tryamkin think he was in KHL shape and thusly in NHL shape? By all reports he shed the weight quickly which implys he knew he was not in shape.  

I think he said somewhere that he overdid his honeymoon and wedding celebrations. I actually thought he thought he would still be put in the team but WD wasn't having that so he knuckled down and as Willie said, worked hard to get back into shape.

[alfstonker]

5 hours ago, janisahockeynut said:

Again  both you and Bourdain make good points and I agree he wasn't  in good shape.....but I think he was still playing as good as other despite his condition........also on the contract issue.......I totally think that it depends on your interpretation  of what good faith is.....for some it is a deal is a deal.....others think it is flexible....If I was a 3 year KHL vet, and found myself knowing I was better than some even though I was out of shape...I may just say nyet....and thanks I will play myself into shape...which is what he did, and to my recollection, he didn't take that long, all the while handling himself as good as anyone not named Tanev.

 

Let me ask you guys a question....Maybe I am out to lunch....but did he look any worse than Hutton or Edler....Really?  If he was there at the beginning, he sure fixed himself quick?

 

If at the end of last season the question was who do you keep Hutton or Tryamkin which would you Take?  And I like Hutton...

I think he did look out of shape. In fact I think I posted on here about it. The point is he also admitted it. He may have thought he masked it in the training camp but I doubt it having seen videos of the tests they are put through. Also he was kidding himself if he thought he could fool vets like WD and Lidster.

[spook007]

7 hours ago, janisahockeynut said:

Again  both you and Bourdain make good points and I agree he wasn't  in good shape.....but I think he was still playing as good as other despite his condition........also on the contract issue.......I totally think that it depends on your interpretation  of what good faith is.....for some it is a deal is a deal.....others think it is flexible....If I was a 3 year KHL vet, and found myself knowing I was better than some even though I was out of shape...I may just say nyet....and thanks I will play myself into shape...which is what he did, and to my recollection, he didn't take that long, all the while handling himself as good as anyone not named Tanev.

 

Let me ask you guys a question....Maybe I am out to lunch....but did he look any worse than Hutton or Edler....Really?  If he was there at the beginning, he sure fixed himself quick?

 

If at the end of last season the question was who do you keep Hutton or Tryamkin which would you Take?  And I like Hutton...

Its kinda like the patients running the asylum. isn't it? 

This is a team sport. What message does it send to the other players, that an NHL rookie obviously out of shape get game time ahead of others working their ass off in the Off season? 

[Drewismyname]

If they were trying to use him to set an example he called their bluff and made them look stupid.

 

So what spend the rest of his rfa years in russia then sign with a team with a russian sub culture in NA. Win win.

 

Willie....i stood up for him while he was coach.....happy to see him gone. I get what the Sedins have done while never winning us a cup but the get away with uninspired play all the time. If youre setting an example its team wide, not just the new guy who is out of his element.

 

The teams that win cups have a no man left behind policy not a mutiple set of standards.

 

I am hoping this changes with Green

 

 

 

 

 

Edited August 28, 2017 by Drewismyname

[ilduce39]

4 hours ago, Drewismyname said:

If they were trying to use him to set an example he called their bluff and made them look stupid.

 

So what spend the rest of his rfa years in russia then sign with a team with a russian sub culture in NA. Win win.

 

Willie....i stood up for him while he was coach.....happy to see him gone. I get what the Sedins have done while never winning us a cup but the get away with uninspired play all the time. If youre setting an example its team wide, not just the new guy who is out of his element.

 

The teams that win cups have a no man left behind policy not a mutiple set of standards.

 

I am hoping this changes with Green

I dunno Drew.  I don't get it but some fans have been hoping for a coach to come in and bench the Sedins (or Edler) for years now.

 

AV, Torts, Willie... all coaches who value hard work and all who leaned heavily on / basically gushed about the Sedins.  

 

It would be a pretty long bet to think Green is going to come in and crack the whip on the Swedes - not because they are/were "stars" but because it won't be needed.

 

A far safer bet would be that these guys were the pace cars for team effort, professionalism and consistency all along - and still are.

[Rob_Zepp]

5 hours ago, Drewismyname said:

I get what the Sedins have done while never winning us a cup but they get away with uninspired play all the time.

 

Soooo, you think that the Sedins do not put their all out effort into their games?   They are lazy?   What exactly are you getting at here?

[ilduce39]

5 hours ago, spook007 said:

Its kinda like the patients running the asylum. isn't it? 

This is a team sport. What message does it send to the other players, that an NHL rookie obviously out of shape get game time ahead of others working their ass off in the Off season? 

A lot of fans hated Willie for it but I thought it was wise - he really squeezed the new guys asking for a certain style of play.  Fitness was a big part of that.  When was the last time we heard of anyone - let alone multiple players show up out of shape?  

 

I don't care if you're a high draft pick or intriguing Russian.  That can't be the new bar.

 

With all the turnover I would hate to lose the consistent hard work and professionalism the "Sedin era" Canucks were good for.  

 

Can we add some killer instinct?  Toughness? Swagger? Absolutely! But I wouldn't want to drop the parts the Sedins got right if I can at all help it.

[SID.IS.SID.ME.IS.ME]

8 minutes ago, ilduce39 said:

I dunno Drew.  I don't get it but some fans have been hoping for a coach to come in and bench the Sedins (or Edler) for years now.

 

AV, Torts, Willie... all coaches who value hard work and all who leaned heavily on / basically gushed about the Sedins.  

 

It would be a pretty long bet to think Green is going to come in and crack the whip on the Swedes - not because they are/were "stars" but because it won't be needed.

 

A far safer bet would be that these guys were the pace cars for team effort, professionalism and consistency all along - and still are.

Yeah, as much as we've seen some age related decline over the past few years with the Sedins, they are hardly the problem. If anything, the struggles the twins have endured have exposed issues with the surrounding team, moreso than difficiencies in their own play.

 

If this team had a wealth of young talent at the top of the lineup, solid quality depth at all positions, and a coach who kept the team firing on all cylinders, I suspect the twins wouldn't see much criticism at all.

 

Clearly, the days of the Sedins being front line players you can build around have passed. And the team failed to address the void quickly enough. We're now playing catchup.

 

Thankfully, we are on the road to recovery, with some good young players in the system and likely several more on the way in the next few drafts.

[ilduce39]

15 minutes ago, SID.IS.SID.ME.IS.ME said:

Yeah, as much as we've seen some age related decline over the past few years with the Sedins, they are hardly the problem. If anything, the struggles the twins have endured have exposed issues with the surrounding team, moreso than difficiencies in their own play.

 

If this team had a wealth of young talent at the top of the lineup, solid quality depth at all positions, and a coach who kept the team firing on all cylinders, I suspect the twins wouldn't see much criticism at all.

 

Clearly, the days of the Sedins being front line players you can build around have passed. And the team failed to address the void quickly enough. We're now playing catchup.

 

Thankfully, we are on the road to recovery, with some good young players in the system and likely several more on the way in the next few drafts.

Oh yeah.  

 

I still remember that CA article at the end of last season showing most teams still matched their top defence pairing against the Sedins.  Pair that with less talent to play with (a young D and a revolving door of wingers) it's not hard to see why Father Time is catching up rather quickly.

 

Optimistically, I think this is the year Bo and Baer take the reigns - I think they're up to it.  

[Drewismyname]

34 minutes ago, Rob_Zepp said:

Soooo, you think that the Sedins do not put their all out effort into their games?   They are lazy?   What exactly are you getting at here?

They have displayed uninspired play since 2011 and have been given a pass by their coaches getting a lot of undeserved top powerplay time.

 

Im getting at the vets need to be held just as accountable as the rookies. Try got given the tough love approach while he coupd barely speak english and then left.

 

He was the most dangerous d prospect we've had since Bourdon rest his soul and willie totally misplayed the situation and now hes in russia.

 

I get the whole paying your dues approach but clearly that is only applied the the ones in willies dog house which sends the wrong message to the team and creates a toxic devisive environment bwtween team mates, not to mention wastes the owners money.

 

Ego has no place in a performance driven industry.

Edited August 28, 2017 by Drewismyname

[Rob_Zepp]

52 minutes ago, Drewismyname said:

They have displayed uninspired play since 2011 and have been given a pass by their coaches getting a lot of undeserved top powerplay time.

 

Im getting at the vets need to be held just as accountable as the rookies. Try got given the tough love approach while he coupd barely speak english and then left.

 

He was the most dangerous d prospect we've had since Bourdon rest his soul and willie totally misplayed the situation and now hes in russia.

 

I get the whole paying your dues approach but clearly that is only applied the the ones in willies dog house which sends the wrong message to the team and creates a toxic devisive environment bwtween team mates, not to mention wastes the owners money.

 

Ego has no place in a performance driven industry.

Wow on the two bolded statements.   Just wow.  

 

• On the first one, these are two HOF players who leave it all on the ice every shift.   They are not flashy, they are not physical but they play their assets off every shift and it takes a missing limb or two to get them out of the lineup.   I am amazed anyone calling themselves a Canuck fan would question their effort.   Have their skills declined as they have aged?   Yup.   Are they winning NHL hardware in their late 30s?  Nope.   However, saying they are not "inspired" to me is simply not compatible with reality.
• By "dangerous" do you mean most likely to lead to a goal on your own team or do you mean he is handy with a weapon?   I am certainly you are not implying from a hockey skill perspective.   If you are, you think he has more potential than Juolevi?    Really?!   I guess I need to add a third "wow".

 

Each to their own opinion but I do not share much of yours in respect to those two points.    You also seem to be blaming the last coach for a player getting married, having a wife who wanted to be back in Russia, a player who didn't report to team in way he was told to and a few other elements that if a coach did have control over would be both creepy and probably illegal in most countries - but you go with that if you wish.

 

Have fun and keep on keeping on slagging the Sedins.   I guess someone has to question the character of two individuals who may have the best character of any professional athletes your Province has even been blessed to be associated with - I guess you are that someone.    You are not questioning their inevitable decline in skills, you are questioning their character.   Wow.