Tre Mac Posted November 17, 2015 Share Posted November 17, 2015 Getting frustrating watching the Sedins chew up the clock for 1min on the PP only to get scored on. Then they start 3on3 and do pretty much the same thing. It's about time to begin the Sedin transition to 2nd liners, atleast on the PP and ot. Edler is a playing like a top 2 dman...... in the AHL. The rest of the D core looks like a ECHL all star team. I cannot blame WD when he has to ice possibly the worst D core in the league. Vrbada, what needs to be said he's checked out. Horvat is struggling mightily. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JamesB Posted November 17, 2015 Share Posted November 17, 2015 23 hours ago, tyhee said: Somehow a 58 year old in his second season as an NHL head coach and a lengthy history as a hockey coach doesn't seem like a rookie to me. Rookie to me means in his first season. I understand your main point about him maybe not feeling like taking risks as he's not an established NHL head coach, though. It has often struck me as strange how WD, who is careful to avoid putting young skaters in a position to fail and has spoken of not putting them in a position to lose confidence, while generally rolling 4 lines so as not to get his skaters tired, plays his goalies without apparent regard for their confidence or fatigue levels. He could have played Markstrom in Toronto this past game. Miller had started the last game (and all but two games this season) and let in a stinker, hadn't been impressive for a while and Toronto on balance rates to be a lesser test than Montreal. I thought and still think Markstrom should have started the Toronto game, giving Miller a rest and giving Markstrom (who has had a tough time in the past in the NHL) the chance to play against the lesser team. Instead Miller played (likely tired) and had an ok game but the Canucks lose while outshooting the Leafs and Markstrom sat, now to get a Montreal team which is better than the Leafs and may have some motivation from their last game against the Canucks when the Canucks beat them fairly easily. There may be reasons I don't know about or haven't thought of, but it didn't make sense to me and I had trouble understanding WD's goaltending decisions last season as well. It seems to me he plays his starter into the ground (whether it was Miller or Lack) getting the backup stale (and the tougher chances) while the starter risks fatigue. Hopefully Markstrom plays well tonight and it all works out. Agree that it does not make sense to call WD a "rookie coach". He is a very experienced coach who has been successful at all levels. And, after last year, that included the NHL as he led the team to a much better season than most people expected, despite the disappointing playoff loss to Calgary. I also thought Marky should have started against TO, but I think that for a featured national TV game, WD probably thought Miller would be insulted if he did not get the start. So for long run morale, Miller got the start. I still think that WD is a good coach. Even this season the Canucks are still in playoff position despite a bad road trip and despite the fact that a lot of people picked them to be one of the worst teams in the league this year and very few picked them to make the playoffs. I think the Canucks big problem right now is lack of talent. They some promising young guys and some high skill vets who are past their prime, but not many high-end players in their prime. If Weber is playing top 4 D, you know your depth chart on D is pretty shallow. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hearditall Posted November 17, 2015 Share Posted November 17, 2015 5 hours ago, snucks said: Consistently losing leads in the 3rd and losing the game in the 3on 3 OT is something Willie seems lost to correct. The team plays well but not for 60 minutes. Thing is its the same scenario over and over again. The Canucks are getting that reputation of a team that folds in the 3rd period. The player need to be coached. Its clear the coaches don't have the answers. Maybe Benning has. How is it Willie's fault that: Weber & Hammer playing the way they are? Edler & Tanev are supposed to be our Keith & Seabrook? Vrbata & Sven are supposed to be our goal scorers but have done nothing to fill their role...Not like Willie hasn't used them in the top 6. So no true #2 line. Horvat having a usual sophmore year. (eg. McKinnon, Huberdeau, M.Richards, Bogosian, Meyers, skinner, etc.) Injuries to Makstrom, Prust, Hammer, Sbisa, Higgins, Burrows, Sutter Blatant (not what WD coaches) mistakes by the VETS in OT, Sedins, Edler, Hammer, etc.) + the youth he's expected to play & develop properly which this year is gone up from 1 to 4 & 5... Which brings us back to reality and all the real predictions before the season started. We are in a transition stage & are a year or 3 away from being a Stanley Cup contender again. Time to be realistic. No coach at this time could have this current roster in the Stanley Cup. Most impessive thing in my eyes is that we're actually in contention to win in EVERY game & have not lost by more than 1 GOAL all season. That's pretty impressive. Not many teams can say that. Usually well coached teams play that way...Maybe it's the players mistakes not the coaches so much.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oldnews Posted November 17, 2015 Share Posted November 17, 2015 Yes, he's out of depth - Sutter, Burrows, Prust, Sbisa out of the lineup - rolling with a young team. That is all. Otherwise doing a great job of integrating youth and remaining competitive. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DIBdaQUIB Posted November 17, 2015 Share Posted November 17, 2015 10 minutes ago, hearditall said: How is it Willie's fault that: Hammer is playing the way he is? Edler & Tanev are supposed to be our Keith & Seabrook? Vrbata & Sven are supposed to be our goal scorers but have done nothing to fill their role...Not like Willie hasn't used them in the top 6. So no true #2 line. Horvat having a usual sophmore year. (eg. McKinnon, Huberdeau, M.Richards, Bogosian, Meyers, skinner, etc.) Injuries to Makstrom, Prust, Hammer, Sbisa, Higgins, Burrows, Sutter Blatant (not what WD coaches) mistakes by the VETS in OT, Sedins, Edler, Hammer, etc.) + the youth he's expected to play & develop properly which this year is gone up from 1 to 4... Which brings us back to reality and all the real predictions before the season started. We are in a transition stage & are a year or 3 away from being a Stanley Cup contender again. Time to be realistic. No coach at this time could have this current roster in the Stanley Cup. Most impessive thing in my eyes is that we're actually in contention to win in EVERY game & have not lost by more than 1 GOAL all season. That's pretty impressive. Not many teams can say that. Usually well coached teams play that way...Maybe it's the players mistakes not the coaches so much.... Definitely the players at fault. Unfortunately - and surprising to many - is that it is our vets who are failing to make the smart play or hold the fort when the bench is shortened. The PP is a disaster despite the 2 goals last game. It seems almost 50/50 if a PP will get us a goal or cost us one. Inexcusable considering it is the veteran 1st unit gifting these opportunities. WD has a tough job of keeping the vets interested at playing their best when they and everyone knows this team is in transition and not a seriously competitive team despite what they may say to the press. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Maniwaki Canuck Posted November 17, 2015 Share Posted November 17, 2015 He can be questioned on a few issues but there's plenty of other reasons why we're slumping right now. Several vets are looking "out of their depth" and there's a limit to how many rookies you can slot in to replace them. Things will look better when Prust, Burrows, Sutter and Sbisa are back in the lineup, and better still if we convert some forward depth into a D upgrade. Until we sort out the glaring personnel issues on this club, it will be hard to evaluate the coaching fairly. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stawns Posted November 17, 2015 Share Posted November 17, 2015 1 minute ago, DIBdaQUIB said: Definitely the players at fault. Unfortunately - and surprising to many - is that it is our vets who are failing to make the smart play or hold the fort when the bench is shortened. The PP is a disaster despite the 2 goals last game. It seems almost 50/50 if a PP will get us a goal or cost us one. Inexcusable considering it is the veteran 1st unit gifting these opportunities. WD has a tough job of keeping the vets interested at playing their best when they and everyone knows this team is in transition and not a seriously competitive team despite what they may say to the press. but that's what he's paid to do and right now it's looking like they are quitting on him the way they did with JT. I'm expecting this may be the last year for WD and Green brought in to coach the young guys next year. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DIBdaQUIB Posted November 17, 2015 Share Posted November 17, 2015 1 hour ago, stawns said: but that's what he's paid to do and right now it's looking like they are quitting on him the way they did with JT. I'm expecting this may be the last year for WD and Green brought in to coach the young guys next year. You could be right but if this core quit on AV, quite on Torts and now quits on WD...what is the point of another coaching change. The problem is obviously the core. Watching the soft play, lazy back-checks, inexcusable and frequent errors by vet players...it doesn't matter who coaches this group. JB needs to clean house. Hansen is the only "vet" who appears willing to put it on the ice every game. Edler, Higgins, Vrbata, Burr, Hamhuis should all be on the block. Maybe Green is a better choice for an even younger group or maybe if WD is given a mandate to develop the youth regardless of winning, he would be more effective. Got to have buy-in from the remaining vets though as we are seeing what happens when they mail it in. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RonMexico Posted November 17, 2015 Share Posted November 17, 2015 3 minutes ago, DIBdaQUIB said: You could be right but if this core quit on AV, quite on Torts and now quits on WD...what is the point of another coaching change. The problem is obviously the core. Watching the soft play, lazy back-checks, inexcusable and frequent errors by vet players...it doesn't matter who coaches this group. JB needs to clean house. Hansen is the only "vet" who appears willing to put it on the ice every game. Edler, Higgins, Vrbata, Burr, Hamhuis should all be on the block. Maybe Green is a better choice for an even younger group or maybe if WD is given a mandate to develop the youth regardless of winning, he would be more effective. Got to have buy-in from the remaining vets though as we are seeing what happens when they mail it in. You are forgetting that ownership has it's own expectations and those expectations rule all. It's all a delicate balance in trying to please everyone but the man who signs the paychecks is the one directing the ship. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DIBdaQUIB Posted November 17, 2015 Share Posted November 17, 2015 20 minutes ago, RonMexico said: You are forgetting that ownership has it's own expectations and those expectations rule all. It's all a delicate balance in trying to please everyone but the man who signs the paychecks is the one directing the ship. True. However, if the current experiment continues with the same on-ice product, the owner is going to find himself with a financial problem due to empty seats. Winning is great but if the team is going to lose, it has a better chance of attracting fan interest by doing so with energetic, young prospects than with slow, underperforming vets. As you say, a balancing act. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
snucks Posted November 17, 2015 Share Posted November 17, 2015 Willie doesn't play the young guys in the OT. He doesn't trust the young guys and its veteran guys that are losing games in the 3rd and OT. It very much reminds me of minor league coaching. So what happens is the energy the youth bring gets stifled late in the game. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
darkpoet Posted November 17, 2015 Share Posted November 17, 2015 On 10/24/2015, 10:16:49, BanTSN said: Look at the standings. We're fine. On average you have to be 10 games over .500 to get into the playoffs. There's still time obviously, but things are definitely not "fine". Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hearditall Posted November 17, 2015 Share Posted November 17, 2015 14 minutes ago, snucks said: Willie doesn't play the young guys in the OT. He doesn't trust the young guys and its veteran guys that are losing games in the 3rd and OT. It very much reminds me of minor league coaching. So what happens is the energy the youth bring gets stifled late in the game. Go check out how much Joe Thornton played in his Rookie season...He's had a pretty good career... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RonMexico Posted November 17, 2015 Share Posted November 17, 2015 27 minutes ago, snucks said: Willie doesn't play the young guys in the OT. He doesn't trust the young guys and its veteran guys that are losing games in the 3rd and OT. It very much reminds me of minor league coaching. So what happens is the energy the youth bring gets stifled late in the game. Such herd mentality. Horvat, Hutton and McCann all had shifts in OT and those 3 plus Virtanen and Baertschi had shifts in the 3rd. Heck even Shinkaruk got 3 shifts in the 3rd while trying to protect the lead. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Canorth Posted November 18, 2015 Share Posted November 18, 2015 19 minutes ago, RonMexico said: Such herd mentality. Horvat, Hutton and McCann all had shifts in OT and those 3 plus Virtanen and Baertschi had shifts in the 3rd. Heck even Shinkaruk got 3 shifts in the 3rd while trying to protect the lead. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
smithers joe Posted November 18, 2015 Share Posted November 18, 2015 we all know that the cdc coaches have more experience coaching then willie does... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Canucks Curse Posted November 18, 2015 Author Share Posted November 18, 2015 looking back, line changes have been a real problem for this team. I don't have any coaching experience in hockey so I am not ure who's fault that is, but it has been a recurring problem at key times and last night there were two bad line changes that really stood out and they were not the first of the season, I recall a pretty bad line change against Pittsburgh and Calgary (game 2) that both ended up in goals. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hairy Kneel Posted November 18, 2015 Share Posted November 18, 2015 I think it's trying to force short shifts...like Get-The-Hell-Off-The-Ice!! And guys are hell bent for leather to the bench not knowing where the puck actually is. Mental mistakes. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Honky Cat Posted November 18, 2015 Share Posted November 18, 2015 The fact the Canucks have gone into the 3rd period and have blown leads basically comes down to inexperience and injuries. This is what you would expect in a transition year...The Canucks are a lot better team than most people thought they would be. Even though I don't like WD's deployment at times..I think he's doing a decent job..If any other coach was coaching the Canucks right now,things would not be that much different...IMO. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
riffraff Posted November 18, 2015 Share Posted November 18, 2015 13 minutes ago, Honky Cat said: The fact the Canucks have gone into the 3rd period and have blown leads basically comes down to inexperience and injuries. This is what you would expect in a transition year...The Canucks are a lot better team than most people thought they would be. Even though I don't like WD's deployment at times..I think he's doing a decent job..If any other coach was coaching the Canucks right now,things would not be that much different...IMO. Agreed. the coach hasn't been and isn't the problem; going back years. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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