bobbyg43 Posted January 3, 2017 Share Posted January 3, 2017 1 hour ago, SID.IS.SID.ME.IS.ME said: Filing a claim on Rattie makes too much sense. Beyond the obvious Winterhawks connection to Baertschi, Rattie has actually put-up a similar NHL scoring rate, in limited minutes, to what Baertschi had when we acquired him. And they have a very similar AHL scoring rate. They're both top-9 or bust players. The Baertschi trade was a good gamble that now appears to have really paid off. Getting Rattie for free isn't even a gamble, but it has the potential to yield similar results. Perusing the Blues forums today, I'm seeing many of the same criticisms on Rattie that Flames fans were making when they moved on from Baertschi. And reading Hitchcock's comments from the just before the start of this season reminds me a lot of earlier comments on Baertschi that came out of Calgary. Hitch on Rattie: "He's got NHL skill, he's got NHL top skill. Can he sustain the work ethic and the determination and the focus away from the puck..." http://lkorac10.blogspot.ca/2016/09/rattie-gets-best-crack-to-stick-in-nhl.html?m=1 Which to me sounds like a classier version of what Brian Burke said about Baertschi in 2013: "All I’ve seen so far is flashes of brilliance. Flashes of brilliance are fine if you’re working in the university, but they’re not much good to people in an NHL building." "There are three zones in the ice surfaces in this league. I don’t see that he’s learned to play and compete in two of them. He’s got to learn there’s a clock in this league and there’s so many minutes in the game and that you’ve got to compete through all of it." "I see big holes and I see a lack of commitment that’s not going to get him anywhere in my books." When Baertschi was traded, Flamesnation wrote an excellent piece on where the Flames went wrong: http://flamesnation.ca/2015/3/3/when-did-the-flames-go-wrong-with-sven-baertschi Here's a key excerpt: When looking at Rattie's history in St. Louis, it's hard not to see parallels to Baertschi and Calgary. One could even argue that Rattie has had a rougher ride and less opportunities. Great analogy onTy. this is so so obvious as a wire claim but perhaps unlikely he gets to 6 th an even more less likely that JB an Trevor would put a claim in. I salavate at the thought of another successful reunion with fellow Sven . Chaput an or Megna can be reassigned to Utica. Megna has proven little an done less as of yet. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Coconuts Posted January 3, 2017 Share Posted January 3, 2017 I'd claim him, but I doubt he falls to us Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oldnews Posted January 3, 2017 Share Posted January 3, 2017 8 minutes ago, Bur14Kes17 said: Paranteaus also not 23 though. Rattie is like a free prospect That is true, but being 23 doesn't make a player "better" than another. I'm not going to get my hopes up on this tbh. First, there's the possibility he gets claimed. Second is the more important question imo - where does he fit in the lineup? Wadr to people who think it's a no-brainer, where does Rattie play? First - imo he's not fast enough and not developed enough defensively to step into the spot vacated by Hansen and occupied by Megna. People may like Rattie's potential and all, but imo he's not viable there. He's also not viable on the Sutter / shutdown line, nor is he anywhere near earning a spot over someone like Granlund. As a winger with Baertschi/Horvat? Here may be the most viable spot for him - at least until Hansen and Burrows return - but again - the team already has Rodin to step into that spot - as he did last night - and I'm both skeptical that Rattie could displace Rodin, and I'm hesitant to gift players like him a spot over a guy that's in the organization and earned/earning his role. So, does Rattie fit on or earn a 4th line role? Do we take him in order to waive a player like Skille, Megna or assign Gaunce? This is the thing - to claim him requires displacing someone else - and before we do that, we have to make the case that it's justified - and not just in an abstract "asset management" sense - as if NHL teams dump roster players to add any 23 yr old with potential that hasn't made it yet. If that were the case Etem would have been here, but would have been waived long ago - and Skille would have been waived to enable that. Players like Pulkinnen, Rattie, PaajarviS, etc etc would have been retained, and all the veteran fourth liners in the league liquidated into AHLers. But the league is more of a meritocracy than that, not simply age/prospect gazers. Rattie is in a deep organization and it may be arguable that he's better than the current depth the team has - but imo that's not necessarily evident, nor is his fit. The thing players like Megna have over him imo is speed - and that combined with the ability to play a 200ft game may actually give them a leg up on a guy at the crossroads like Rattie. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Warhippy Posted January 3, 2017 Share Posted January 3, 2017 Step 1. Claim Rattie Step 2. Give him the Toronto and sit him for months Step 3. Conditioning stint Step 4. Start him in Utica to start next season Bettman legal baby! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alflives Posted January 4, 2017 Share Posted January 4, 2017 2 minutes ago, Warhippy said: Step 1. Claim Rattie Step 2. Give him the Toronto and sit him for months Step 3. Conditioning stint Step 4. Start him in Utica to start next season Bettman legal baby! Who do we send down or waive though to make room for Rattie to sit in the press box? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aGENT Posted January 4, 2017 Share Posted January 4, 2017 10 minutes ago, oldnews said: That is true, but being 23 doesn't make a player "better" than another. I'm not going to get my hopes up on this tbh. First, there's the possibility he gets claimed. Second is the more important question imo - where does he fit in the lineup? Wadr to people who think it's a no-brainer, where does Rattie play? First - imo he's not fast enough and not developed enough defensively to step into the spot vacated by Hansen and occupied by Megna. People may like Rattie's potential and all, but imo he's not viable there. He's also not viable on the Sutter / shutdown line, nor is he anywhere near earning a spot over someone like Granlund. As a winger with Baertschi/Horvat? Here may be the most viable spot for him - at least until Hansen and Burrows return - but again - the team already has Rodin to step into that spot - as he did last night - and I'm both skeptical that Rattie could displace Rodin, and I'm hesitant to gift players like him a spot over a guy that's in the organization and earned/earning his role. So, does Rattie fit on or earn a 4th line role? Do we take him in order to waive a player like Skille, Megna or assign Gaunce? This is the thing - to claim him requires displacing someone else - and before we do that, we have to make the case that it's justified - and not just in an abstract "asset management" sense - as if NHL teams dump roster players to add any 23 yr old with potential that hasn't made it yet. If that were the case Etem would have been here, but would have been waived long ago - and Skille would have been waived to enable that. Players like Pulkinnen, Rattie, PaajarviS, etc etc would have been retained, and all the veteran fourth liners in the league liquidated into AHLers. But the league is more of a meritocracy than that, not simply age/prospect gazers. Rattie is in a deep organization and it may be arguable that he's better than the current depth the team has - but imo that's not necessarily evident, nor is his fit. The thing players like Megna have over him imo is speed - and that combined with the ability to play a 200ft game may actually give them a leg up on a guy at the crossroads like Rattie. @LaBamba will love this but I came in here to basically post that. Honestly, as much as I'd love to nab a free prospect of his quality, where does he fit...? We already have 3 similar (and arguably more NHL ready) guys similar to him. Unless we 'Corrado' him like @Warhippy suggests (which is a dick move IMO), we don't have room for him. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bobbyg43 Posted January 4, 2017 Share Posted January 4, 2017 21 minutes ago, Warhippy said: Step 1. Claim Rattie Step 2. Give him the Toronto and sit him for months Step 3. Conditioning stint Step 4. Start him in Utica to start next season Bettman legal baby! Good one hence we get a free prospect with high end potential next fall. had not thought of Gaunce as candidate to send down an hate to do it It would have to be Chaput or Megna . Move Rodin to Sedin line slot ty on Bo an Sven line you have a 2/3 two way play responsibly on line an quick study in Ty till TDL to learn the lacking side of his game . this makes too much sense for our management regime to even consider. JB has MO of paying picks can you imagine hitting a double double with Sven an Ty (the cost a 2 bs pick for both) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kingofsurrey Posted January 4, 2017 Share Posted January 4, 2017 16 minutes ago, Warhippy said: Step 1. Claim Rattie Step 2. Give him the Toronto and sit him for months Step 3. Conditioning stint Step 4. Start him in Utica to start next season Bettman legal baby! Agree 100 %. Great project player. The guy has scored in every league but the NHL and maybe just needs more seasoning. Great player to add to the organization. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gaudette Celly Posted January 4, 2017 Share Posted January 4, 2017 5 minutes ago, kingofsurrey said: Agree 100 %. Great project player. The guy has scored in every league but the NHL and maybe just needs more seasoning. Great player to add to the organization. Why do I keep hearing echoes of "Linden Vey... Linden Vey..."? Plenty of these type of guys around, it's why the GMs and their staff get paid to determine which ones truly have the potential to make it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kingofsurrey Posted January 4, 2017 Share Posted January 4, 2017 7 minutes ago, Hutton Wink said: Why do I keep hearing echoes of "Linden Vey... Linden Vey..."? Plenty of these type of guys around, it's why the GMs and their staff get paid to determine which ones truly have the potential to make it. Well we traded pick for Vey but we can sign this guy and not give up anything.. The question is will he make it through till Canucks pick.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
garthsbutcher Posted January 4, 2017 Share Posted January 4, 2017 I'd rather have Rattie than any of kaput or Megna and don't get me going on about Gaunce. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oldnews Posted January 4, 2017 Share Posted January 4, 2017 35 minutes ago, Warhippy said: Step 1. Claim Rattie Step 2. Give him the Toronto and sit him for months Step 3. Conditioning stint Step 4. Start him in Utica to start next season Bettman legal baby! I like it. He'd still have to clear waivers to start in Utica next year, but deal with that in due course. I say just conditioning stint him straight up - why wait a few months? He's been sitting most of the year as it is. If we had another injury up front I'd probably take a flyer - who knows how long Burrows eye injury keeps him out. If he's on the verge of returning, I suspect they'll pass but with Hansen out another month, Dorsett done, and Burrows down it'll be interesting. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oldnews Posted January 4, 2017 Share Posted January 4, 2017 6 minutes ago, garthsbutcher said: I'd rather have Rattie than any of kaput or Megna and don't get me going on about Gaunce. http://stats.hockeyanalysis.com/ratings.php?db=201617&sit=5v5&type=corsi&teamid=29&pos=skaters&minutes=200&disp=1&sort=PCT&sortdir=DESC corsi http://stats.hockeyanalysis.com/ratings.php?disp=1&db=201617&sit=5v5&pos=skaters&minutes=200&teamid=29&type=corsi&sort=OZPCT&sortdir=DESC ozone starts. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
garthsbutcher Posted January 4, 2017 Share Posted January 4, 2017 1 minute ago, oldnews said: http://stats.hockeyanalysis.com/ratings.php?db=201617&sit=5v5&type=corsi&teamid=29&pos=skaters&minutes=200&disp=1&sort=PCT&sortdir=DESC corsi http://stats.hockeyanalysis.com/ratings.php?disp=1&db=201617&sit=5v5&pos=skaters&minutes=200&teamid=29&type=corsi&sort=OZPCT&sortdir=DESC ozone starts. I'll take a some Goals over a Corsi rating everyday but that's just me! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alflives Posted January 4, 2017 Share Posted January 4, 2017 3 minutes ago, oldnews said: http://stats.hockeyanalysis.com/ratings.php?db=201617&sit=5v5&type=corsi&teamid=29&pos=skaters&minutes=200&disp=1&sort=PCT&sortdir=DESC corsi http://stats.hockeyanalysis.com/ratings.php?disp=1&db=201617&sit=5v5&pos=skaters&minutes=200&teamid=29&type=corsi&sort=OZPCT&sortdir=DESC ozone starts. Loui Eriksson is our best player? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oldnews Posted January 4, 2017 Share Posted January 4, 2017 2 minutes ago, garthsbutcher said: I'll take a some Goals over a Corsi rating everyday but that's just me! Scoring goals isn't necessarily the role or expectation of Gaunce (or Chaput) at this point though. Would be nice, but at the same time, a rookie with the lowest ozone starts and one of the best shot attempt differentials - suggest that the fourth line is doing their job - limiting chances/goals against, generating territory and whenever possible, spending time in the attacking zone. It's a pretty good ground for a future shutdown or middle six two way forward imo. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Silky mitts Posted January 4, 2017 Share Posted January 4, 2017 1 hour ago, Coconuts said: I'd claim him, but I doubt he falls to us This Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DeNiro Posted January 4, 2017 Share Posted January 4, 2017 Benning won't claim him. Willie thinks his team is real gud and won't risk messing with chemistry. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oldnews Posted January 4, 2017 Share Posted January 4, 2017 11 minutes ago, DeNiro said: Benning won't claim him. Willie thinks his team is real gud and won't risk messing with chemistry. now there's a change of pace. DeNiro is speaking for someone else again. Yawn. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Salmonberries Posted January 4, 2017 Share Posted January 4, 2017 1 hour ago, Warhippy said: Step 1. Claim Rattie Step 2. Give him the Toronto and sit him for months Step 3. Conditioning stint Step 4. Start him in Utica to start next season Bettman legal baby! Now there is a plan. What about Boucher, can he actually play for us. One on the ice, one in the bush? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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