Why are we never in on top free agents? Toffoli gone to Montreal. Our group going forward.

[Ballisticsports.]

4 hours ago, Iggynucks said:

The last time we were in on a “top free agent” was Loui Eriksson and Milan Lucic. Almost all big name free agents become free agents because their price tag no longer matches their value.

Exactly, you don't need big name expensive free agents that rarely turn out, you just need complimenting players

Vegas was built without what would have been big name free agents and only 2, 1st rounders Sbisa and Fleury

Build your team with vison, the type you want and plan for your approaching window of opportunity

 

If any time is a good time to ice a weak team, it is when the owner doesn't have to worry about icing a team to draw people to come fill the arena, because it won't be at full capacity anyways. So if your cleaning house, now is the time, Just have a plan and vison

[Guest]

1 hour ago, Duodenum said:

Guess the better GM:

 

Benning: 2nd and madden for 17 games of Toffoli

Sakic: 2nd and 2nd for like 400+ games of devon toews.

 

Just follow what the top GMs in the league do and you quickly see just how woeful Benning is other than drafting.

It's easy to cherry pick trades for the sake of your argument, and do it after a world pandemic.  You're also projecting 400 games into the future for Devon Toews.  

 

I'm not sure what to tell you, Colorado Avalanche are about three years ahead of us in terms of their rebuild and that LOOKS like a great trade by Sakic for now, but Toews hasn't even signed with them yet and hasn't played a game for Colorado. 

[Jetliner]

chill. benning will get us 2 solid defensemen this week. then all the doubters can stfu

[philtbc829]

Yup it has been all subtractions thus far, JB is paying for the mistakes of his past alright. lets hope the youth of the franchise can set up next year

[sockeye]

We have been in big on UFAs and that has been our problem (ie Eriksson, Sutter, Beagle, Roussel, Ferland).

 

This year, we couldn't if we wanted to be in big on UFAs.  It's pretty simple - some big contracts coming up (Hughes, Petterson and Demko) and lack of cap space.  

 

As Ray Ferraro says, "Free Agency hasn't been our friend".

[Schmautzie]

Overpaying for fourth liners in the past shouldn’t mean we can’t underpay now for a legitimate first liner like Toffoli. 

[Canuckfanforlife82]

1 hour ago, ba;;isticsports said:

Exactly, you don't need big name expensive free agents that rarely turn out, you just need complimenting players

Vegas was built without what would have been big name free agents and only 2, 1st rounders Sbisa and Fleury

Build your team with vison, the type you want and plan for your approaching window of opportunity

 

If any time is a good time to ice a weak team, it is when the owner doesn't have to worry about icing a team to draw people to come fill the arena, because it won't be at full capacity anyways. So if your cleaning house, now is the time, Just have a plan and vison

I am not saying big expensive ones now. It is more I would love for once for us to be in a position to sign one if there was one available. I am tired of seeing other teams always in the mix. Teams like Las Vegas which are already one of the elite teams.

Edited October 13, 2020 by Canuckfanforlife82

[Kragar]

I don't get why people are freaking out over losing Madden (and a 2nd).  When Boeser got hurt last year, Toffoli was brought in to help ensure we got in the playoffs, and as a result we gave Tampa NJ a fairly low-end 1st rounder to wrap up the Miller deal.  Nice job, JB!

 

I doubt Madden is going to make a name for himself in this league, and he especially wasn't going to do it with the Canucks, so what's the big deal there?.  I'm disappointed to see TT go, and surprised he was interested in going so far East, given his family situation, but that's the game.  The other three players that left, that's ok too.  As much as I liked all three and would be happy to have them on the team, Marky wasn't ever going to get the term and protection he wanted here, I'm glad that Tanev got term somewhere else, and while I really appreciated Stech's game, losing him is not the end of the world by any means.

 

1 hour ago, Canuckfanforlife82 said:

I have never liked the term on those free agent deals and it just seems like money not well spent especially when we are one of the highest paying teams in terms of bottom two lines. That is not a fact I like associated with this team. We pay 25 million for our bottom two lines.

 

If you don't like the term on the bottom 6, I don't think you should be lamenting the alleged inability to sign top free agents.  Since I assume you are counting Loui's 6M in your 25M count, first off, he wasn't signed as a 3rd liner, and second, it wouldn't be the first time a player got overpaid on Canada Day.

 

Have some fun, and take a look back at all the big signings in 2016, the year we got Loui.  You'll see some other nice ones: Okposo (7 yrs, 6m per), Backes (5 yrs, 6m per), Nielsen (6 yrs, over 5m per), Lucic (7 yrs, 6m per), Ladd (7 yrs, 5.5m per).  And they all declined on their new teams.  You can also find some long term signings of bottom 6 guys too.  Matt Martin and Troy Brouwer both got a 4 year deal.  As did Dale Weise!!! 

 

I'm guessing if you check out other off-seasons, you will see similar mistakes (even the great Joe Sakic made a noticeable goof in 2015).  Supply and demand at work.  If you want to "be in on top free agents", as you say, you're gonna have to shell out term, money and/or protection to outbid the others.

[Duodenum]

1 hour ago, VancouverHabitant said:

It's easy to cherry pick trades for the sake of your argument, and do it after a world pandemic.  You're also projecting 400 games into the future for Devon Toews.  

 

I'm not sure what to tell you, Colorado Avalanche are about three years ahead of us in terms of their rebuild and that LOOKS like a great trade by Sakic for now, but Toews hasn't even signed with them yet and hasn't played a game for Colorado. 

There's plenty of things to show. Benning has been here, what, 8 years? Sakic has been the GM for 7 and they were a last place team. He's made a slew of excellent moves to make them a,now, perennial contender for the foreseeable future. Kadri, Burakovsky, drafting Makar, amazing MacKinnon contract, excellent Duchene return, Graves, Grubauer and more are all him. Both Graves and Toews are excellent, young defenseman that would look great on our back-end. A back end that Benning has failed to improve upon year after year. Overpaying for Myers, Gudbranson's disastrous stint. Sakic traded for Graves while Benning traded for Derek Pouliot. I don't need to cherry pick, there's a whole gdamn cherry tree there of terrible moves as the real good GMs of the league win cups and build contenders. 

 

If we are 3 years behind Colorado, you are saying it will take Benning 11 years to get to where Sakic got in 6. And that's no guarantee. We still have the same crap defense we've always had and aren't any closer to getting a good one.

 

I know if I'm Aquilini, I do not allow Benning to be the guy to shape out the rest of the team around the kids. No freaking way. 

 

Edited October 13, 2020 by Duodenum

[Amebushi]

15 minutes ago, Canuckfanforlife82 said:

I am not saying big expensive ones now. It is more I would love for once for us to be in a position to sign one if there was one available. I am tired of seeing other teams always in the mix. Teams like Las Vegas which are already one of the elite teams.

So big name UFA’s are something you would love for once to be in position to sign. Big names, like Louie Eriksson?  We were in a position to sign him and did, also Myers was a pretty big name UFA dman. Beagle was a decent part of a cup winning team...the names you keep complaining about are the big name UFA’s you are complaining you want the ability to sign. Sometimes the best deal is the one you don’t make. You can keep complaining but JB had a lot of doubters and this year turned out OK. Quick...fire the guy that just got you past the defending champs and took Vegas to game 7. He picked up Miller for the 20th overall. Does this buy him 0 slack to even fill a roster without calling for his head?

Edited October 13, 2020 by Amebushi
Spelling

[Ballisticsports.]

5 minutes ago, Canuckfanforlife82 said:

I am not saying big expensive ones now. It is more I would love for once for us to be in a position to sign one if there was one available. I am tired of seeing othet teams always in the mix.

I am ok with not going in yet, because we will not contend yet, it is not our window of opportunity

I would like to plan better and save cap space for opportunities in the future

I was disappointed in Dec when JB said he wanted another top 6 forward and that was months BEFORE Brock was even injured !

 

I thought then/now that D was the one than needed help with more than anything

What confuses me now is that he said he wanted another top 6 forward while we had a healthy BB (and Baer in minors who was playing  and was just given $3 million, so why not play him) ? 

So now he doesn't want the top 6 anymore and just gave away assets to get one?

 

I think they should just come out and say what there plan is, because it always contradicts what is said

Right from the start when they said after EP was here,  were going with drafts and youth and then they sign older vets with no chance for a younger guy to the in the line-up, even if he earned it, then Linden left

Is it any wonder people are so divided? no one can say for sure what the plan is, because it isn't even shared anymore

[khay]

15 minutes ago, Duodenum said:

There's plenty of things to show. Benning has been here, what, 8 years? Sakic has been the GM for 7 and they were a last place team. He's made a slew of excellent moves to make them a,now, perennial contender for the foreseeable future. Kadri, Burakovsky, drafting Makar, amazing MacKinnon contract, excellent Duchene return, Graves, Grubauer and more are all him. Both Graves and Toews are excellent, young defenseman that would look great on our back-end. A back end that Benning has failed to improve upon year after year. Overpaying for Myers, Gudbranson's disastrous stint. Sakic traded for Graves while Benning traded for Derek Pouliot. I don't need to cherry pick, there's a whole gdamn cherry tree there of terrible moves as the real good GMs of the league win cups and build contenders. 

 

If we are 3 years behind Colorado, you are saying it will take Benning 11 years to get to where Sakic got in 6. And that's no guarantee. We still have the same crap defense we've always had and aren't any closer to getting a good one.

 

I know if I'm Aquilini, I do not allow Benning to be the guy to shape out the rest of the team around the kids. No freaking way. 

 

JB has been here 6 years, Sakic 7 years.

 

Jim Benning started in 2014. Joe Sakic started in 2013.

JB started with 6th overall pick in 2014. He inherited 2nd and 3rd overall picks from 1999 on the roster and a disgruntled former Selke winner drafted in 2003.

 

OTOH, Joe Sakic was handed a 1st overall pick in 2013. He inherited a roster that featured a 2nd overall pick in 2011 and a 3rd overall pick in 2009 as well as future Selke winner also drafted in 2009. 

 

Roster on the rise vs roster on the decline, completely different starting points and the assets.

 

And no, we are not 3 years behind Colorado. 

 

[coolboarder]

1 hour ago, VancouverHabitant said:

Here's a list of some UFAs for next summer:  

 

Ryan Nugent-Hopkins 

Dougie Hamilton 

Gabriel Landeskog 

Jaden Schwartz 

Brendan Gallagher 

Phillip Danault 

Jeff Petry 

Joel Armia 

Matt Calvert 

Nick Foligno 

Marcus Foligno 

David Savard  

Taylor Hall 

Tyson Barrie 

Brandon Montour 

Adam Lowry 

Jamie Oleksiak 

 

You also have the odd perennial all-star such as Ovechkin, Getzlaf, Krejci, Tuukka Rask, Peka Rinne, etc...  

 

So let's not panic that we get a year where our young guys have a chance to earn a roster spot.  

They are all old with exception of Landskog.    Majority of them don't fit within the team identify.  

[JPizzle]

I guess time will tell. I like the prospects we have but in all honesty can they fill the shoes of the players we’ve lost?Injuries are inevitable and it seems like we now have zero depth.

[Ballisticsports.]

49 minutes ago, Kragar said:

I don't get why people are freaking out over losing Madden (and a 2nd).  When Boeser got hurt last year, Toffoli was brought in to help ensure we got in the playoffs, and as a result we gave Tampa NJ a fairly low-end 1st rounder to wrap up the Miller deal.  Nice job, JB!

I doubt Madden is going to make a name for himself in this league, and he especially wasn't going to do it with the Canucks, so what's the big deal there?. 

Only that Benning said 2 months before BB getting hurt that he wanted another top 6 forward, (when imo it should have been a D man to focus on)

Also, wasn't Baer paid $3 Million to be on top 6?, They let him play on their farm team, so it wasn't to protect him from injury

The big deal i guess if you call it that is

Whether Madden makes it or not, he could have been packaged towards "keeping" a D full time 

He wanted another top 6 forward, before BB was hurt and he doesn't now?

The direction is all over the map, let the public know what the plan is

He let it be known he wanted a forward, what is the plan now?

Edited October 13, 2020 by ba;;isticsports

[Amebushi]

17 minutes ago, JPizzle said:

I guess time will tell. I like the prospects we have but in all honesty can they fill the shoes of the players we’ve lost?Injuries are inevitable and it seems like we now have zero depth.

I feel like Nate Schmidt will go a long way to help fill the void on D...and for a third round pick!

[Moe Knows]

I like Benning but I am gobsmacked that he let Toffoli walk when he could have signed him for 4.5 million over 4 years  (considering he paid 6 Million for that superstar LE). A real head scratcher and JB dropped the ball on this one big time IMO

[Samgagner'sface]

6 hours ago, Canuckfanforlife82 said:

The biggest issue I have is that we throw away picks and prospects for nothing. That’s Madden and a second for nothing. When you aren’t elite you can’t afford to do that. Benning isn’t held accountable either so that’s a problem. It’s scary to think he might make more trades.

It wasn't for nothing. It was to help the team get into the playoffs when boeser got hurt. He came right out and said as much. I don't believe he was ever really a part of the long term plan. He was a pure rental that did exactly what he was rented to do. Steep price maybe,  but I am pretty happy that the kids got the chance to play into the playoffs this year and see what it feels like.  I'm  not upset with those results 

[iceman64]

6 hours ago, Canuckfanforlife82 said:

The lack of cap space is the amount we pay spent on bottom six forwards. Thats on Benning. The money is not well spent.

Yeah actually it is, Sutter helping AG, Rousell on JV.. Beagle has helped with Bo... Want more? 

[iceman64]

38 minutes ago, Samgagner'sface said:

It wasn't for nothing. It was to help the team get into the playoffs when boeser got hurt. He came right out and said as much. I don't believe he was ever really a part of the long term plan. He was a pure rental that did exactly what he was rented to do. Steep price maybe,  but I am pretty happy that the kids got the chance to play into the playoffs this year and see what it feels like.  I'm  not upset with those results 

People usually forget the experience and mentor scenario's behind trades that don't just show on the ice in the future when it's long since forgotten..

Every one of our youth has a taste of the big show now, and that's got us a few steps ahead in the build which isn't ever done without it...

 Every team will be playing ELC's now and ours will be pretty damn good, can't wait to see Hogs on Bo's flank, and either JV is on it or gone, can still be traded after ARB or exposed in the draft I guess or 3rd line... Whatever... And next year Podz, excited to see that kid with another year under his belt.. Hogs Podz n Bo? Wow yes please!