samurai Posted March 19, 2020 Share Posted March 19, 2020 5 minutes ago, oldnews said: Really - what I'm talking about goes beyond the responsibility of grocers - who have become a 'front line' in a crisis that they weren't necessarily prepared, nor responsible for. The measures of point of entry hand washing - should be approached imo at the level of health ministers and health officers - who should mandate this change - and then provide assistance and resources - in a public private partnership - to get this done asap. Governors are talking about things like utilizing national guard, military, federal military engineers - to build triage or permanemt health care faciilities to prepare for an over-capacitiization of their resources. But right now - we can and should be acting with a similar preventative urgency - at those sites where we remain vulnerable. While grocers are making some changes - mostly reactive imo - I think there needs to be significantly more done at an intersection where we do actually have an 'opportunity' to proactively 'attack' the spread - in the areas where we are simply not able to social isolate. This is for the average Joe. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oldnews Posted March 19, 2020 Share Posted March 19, 2020 5 minutes ago, AlwaysACanuckFan said: Those hand washing stations is a great idea if people actually use them. Case in point, there were I'd say at least 20 people walking in front of me. Half of those looked at the station but kept on walking, other half didn't even look. I squirted two shots in my hands. As I looked behind me others followed suit. Virtually no one is using the hand sanitizers/wipes provided - and no one is requiring them to. The reality is that health officials have imposed limits on the number of people that are supposed to be entering premises. I'm not talking about putting up stations for people to voluntarily use. I'm talking about requiring them to be used. And further, having those people attending them keep track of the numbers of people they are permitting in the store. If people don't want to use them - shop online. Or have someone else do your shopping. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oldnews Posted March 19, 2020 Share Posted March 19, 2020 4 minutes ago, samurai said: This is for the average Joe. the what? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
samurai Posted March 19, 2020 Share Posted March 19, 2020 Just now, oldnews said: the what? you know, the guy. yeah that guy. he's talking about that thing. you know the thing. the other guy is some doc or something Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
King Heffy Posted March 19, 2020 Share Posted March 19, 2020 10 minutes ago, oldnews said: Virtually no one is using the hand sanitizers/wipes provided - and no one is requiring them to. The reality is that health officials have imposed limits on the number of people that are supposed to be entering premises. I'm not talking about putting up stations for people to voluntarily use. I'm talking about requiring them to be used. And further, having those people attending them keep track of the numbers of people they are permitting in the store. If people don't want to use them - shop online. Or have someone else do your shopping. Ew. I'm personally using them everywhere possible. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
milk and honey Posted March 19, 2020 Share Posted March 19, 2020 4 hours ago, gurn said: Using numbers that Nuckin Futz had published during the China phase of this, the number was at 1 in 36 or 37. I admit to switching to this WHO link https://experience.arcgis.com/experience/685d0ace521648f8a5beeeee1b9125cd a few weeks ago, at which time their numbers were 1 in 33 ish. As others have pointed out, some countries are hit harder due to the age and general health of their people. But that said 1 in 24 is very scary. Canada numbers at this link http://www.covid-19canada.com/ 703 cases 9 deaths 11 recovered 1 in 78 Canada wide B.C. 231 cases 7 deaths 6 recovered 1 in 33. This number, and Canada's are a bit too soon to take as a valid number as the sample size is still very small, and B.C. had an older folks hospital get hit at the beginning. I'm just keeping an eye on the trend. My friends were saying to that numbers aren't true since Chinese officials aren't likely to be telling the true number and don't know how many are actually affected. Not to mention younger people in Europe and North America aren't getting tested if sick knowing it's not likely to kill them. Obviously no way to prove their thinking but their thinking is probably right imo. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
guntrix Posted March 19, 2020 Share Posted March 19, 2020 People should just self-isolate. Micro-analyzing the use of sanitizers/hand wipes/soap/washing stations isn't going to do much if you're walking around outside, especially now that it's been proven that the virus can survive on surfaces for up to three days, can be airborne for up to half an hour, and is easily transmissible through people that show no symptoms. We're pretty much being asked to stay on our couch, it's not that confusing. No matter how hygienically responsible you are, if you're leaving your house frequently, you're part of the problem. 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
samurai Posted March 19, 2020 Share Posted March 19, 2020 53 minutes ago, spur1 said: When going to grocery stores wear gloves...do not touch your face(easier said than done). Upon arriving home disinfect the products and gloves. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PhillipBlunt Posted March 19, 2020 Share Posted March 19, 2020 Thankfully I grabbed a couple of boxes of neoprene gloves a few months back. Using them when needed. Especially at grocery stores. I try to only grab what I intend to take. For instance, today I went to stock up on wine. Got to the store, parked the car, applied some hand sanitizer, and put on gloves. Used the gloves to open the door, and to grab the bottles. Used a debit card, and once done, used a Lysol wipe to wipe the card before placing back in my wallet. Once out of the store, I removed the gloves properly, turning the inside out and threw them in the trash. I still see way too many people not giving proper space when walking especially in grocery stores. I think that the grocery stores should employee a rule of 20 or less in the store at a time. As well, upon check out, the person should have their groceries scrutinized and any hoarding of supplies negated. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Green Building Posted March 19, 2020 Share Posted March 19, 2020 32 minutes ago, King Heffy said: Yep. Great ideas. Personally, I'm wearing gloves while I shop and using my keys to enter my PIN. I'm also letting the elderly cut ahead of me in the lineup; get them out of there as soon as possible. Definitely want to see the belts sanitized more often, as well as the removal of cash as a payment option for manned tills. I don't want anyone handling cash and then my food. Finally, cordon off the bulk food and have a staff member dispense orders, similar to the deli. Way too many hands in the bins. Holy crap this. Bulk bins are crap on normal days, but now it's even worse. Personally, I'm not rolling those dice today, and wouldn't be opposed to shutting them down entirely (aside from things that need cooking like beans, rice, etc, but the other day I watched multiple people walk by the candy bins, reach their hands inside to grab and eat, then walk away as though nothing happened. Yeah, I'll pass on the fuzzy peaches unless they're in a sealed bag. To add to what yourself and @oldnews are mentioning, food-handling staff apparently need a refresher on foodsafe as the number of people I see scratching their eyes or face before wandering over to the deli slicer is unacceptable on a normal day, we are not, however, operating on normal days here. Heightened awareness and training stops or slows the spread, but in light of how people tend to be people anyways, simply do yourselves a favour and stay away from deli meat and bulk food intended for raw consumption until this blows over. ps: holy crap is it ever fun to touch ones own face. I probably do it 3000 times per day. Only now I do it inside the comfort of my own home after having washed my hands, and when in public I'm constantly, like a broken record, saying to myself "don't touch your face" even if both hands are already full. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oldnews Posted March 19, 2020 Share Posted March 19, 2020 3 minutes ago, samurai said: you know, the guy. yeah that guy. he's talking about that thing. you know the thing. the other guy is some doc or something woosh. The doc is talking about his concern primarily with health care workers. Health care workers are certainly unable to self-isolate - or even distance in many contexts - but we/they are people who are trained, informed and aware of best practices. Whether they will have enough resources is another matter. That appears to be his primary concern. However, the idea that the public is just being fed pablum in thinking they can do anything to prevent or effect the spread - is absurd. Transmission occurs throughout the community - and obviously, in those areas of high traffic and exposure - it is intensified. I'm talking about what has become another 'front line' - where not only are workers not prepared, protected, informed - but they are experiencing more traffic, more demand than is normally the case. The fact of the matter is that people who can transmit the virus aren't necessarily aware that they carry it - many people do not present symptoms, most people are untested - and are not limited to people under the care of the health industry - people that are ill, present conditions, and who health professionals are exposed to. That is one front - I'm talking about another where there is far less attention, awareness - and any trained eye can sit and observe the countless vulnerabilities that transpire constantly in a context like a grocery store. Their facilities are not designed to deal with these contingencies. And they arguably need to be under the circumstances - which requires fairly low-tech changes that alone will not end the spread - it will simply reduce it, which is precisely the goal. No one is under the illusion that simple hand washing will terminate the spread of this virus - while at the same time underplaying the simplest, common sense defenses is irresponsible/ignorant and counterproductive. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EmilyM Posted March 19, 2020 Share Posted March 19, 2020 2 minutes ago, guntrix said: People should just self-isolate. Micro-analyzing the use of sanitizers/hand wipes/soap/washing stations isn't going to do much if you're walking around outside, especially now that it's been proven that the virus can survive on surfaces for up to three days, can be airborne for up to half an hour, and is easily transmissible through people that show no symptoms. We're pretty much being asked to stay on our couch, it's not that confusing. No matter how hygienically responsible you are, if you're leaving your house frequently, you're part of the problem. Obviously leaving your house frequently is irresponsible, but the use of sanitizers is still a valid conversation to have considering there are circumstances where certain people must leave the house (not everywhere has grocery delivery or deliveries are backlogged for weeks) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
samurai Posted March 19, 2020 Share Posted March 19, 2020 1 minute ago, oldnews said: woosh. The doc is talking about his concern primarily with health care workers. Health care workers are certainly unable to self-isolate - or even distance in many contexts - but we/they are people who are trained, informed and aware of best practices. Whether they will have enough resources is another matter. That appears to be his primary concern. However, the idea that the public is just being fed pablum in thinking they can do anything to prevent or effect the spread - is absurd. Transmission occurs throughout the community - and obviously, in those areas of high traffic and exposure - it is intensified. I'm talking about what has become another 'front line' - where not only are workers not prepared, protected, informed - but they are experiencing more traffic, more demand than is normally the case. The fact of the matter is that people who can transmit the virus aren't necessarily aware that they carry it - many people do not present symptoms, most people are untested - and are not limited to people under the care of the health industry - people that are ill, present conditions, and who health professionals are exposed to. That is one front - I'm talking about another where there is far less attention, awareness - and any trained eye can sit and observe the countless vulnerabilities that transpire constantly in a context like a grocery store. Their facilities are not designed to deal with these contingencies. And they arguably need to be under the circumstances - which requires fairly low-tech changes that alone will not end the spread - it will simply reduce it, which is precisely the goal. No one is under the illusion that simple hand washing will terminate the spread of this virus - while at the same time underplaying the simplest, common sense defenses is irresponsible/ignorant and counterproductive. if the first part of the video he is talking about people in general and how it is transmitted. He is a leading expert on infectious diseases. He has other informative videos. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oldnews Posted March 19, 2020 Share Posted March 19, 2020 7 minutes ago, guntrix said: People should just self-isolate. Micro-analyzing the use of sanitizers/hand wipes/soap/washing stations isn't going to do much if you're walking around outside, especially now that it's been proven that the virus can survive on surfaces for up to three days, can be airborne for up to half an hour, and is easily transmissible through people that show no symptoms. We're pretty much being asked to stay on our couch, it's not that confusing. No matter how hygienically responsible you are, if you're leaving your house frequently, you're part of the problem. You're missing the point. What you state is true only to the extent that it is possible. Self-isolation, unfortunately, has it's limits. You can't self isolate health care professionals/providers - and likewise with the food supply chain - a point which people need to access. The reality is that there is not capacity to provide universal delivery/online purchasing etc - and not everyone was able to stock up enough, or can afford to 'stockpile'. That intersection where people need to re-access - outside of self-isolation - is the point of addressing that specific vulnerability - that hasn't adequately been gameplanned by public officials or private industry. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nuckin_futz Posted March 19, 2020 Share Posted March 19, 2020 15 Among Brazilian Delegation That Met With Trump Now Have Coronavirus General Augusto Heleno, 72, confirms he has coronavirus, along many others who traveled with Bolsonaro to Mar-a-Lago on March 7, Brazil's Globo newspaper reports. 'Please Stop Shooting Each Other': Baltimore Mayor Begs Residents To Keep Hospital Beds Clear For Coronavirus Patients "We cannot clog up our hospitals and their beds with people that are being shot senselessly." US Restaurant Association Projects Up To 7 Million Jobs Lost Over 3 Months Seeking $455 billion in total federal aid due to coronavirus hit... Tesla Employees Forced To Use Paid Time Off If Staying Home For Covid-19 Those who run out of PTO can "borrow" 80 hours from the company. How nice... 62% Of Americans Believe Media Has Exaggerated Covid-19 Risk, New Poll Shows Majority think press has overhyped the threat... Covid-19 Could Bankrupt Most Airlines By End Of May "...many airlines have probably already been driven into technical bankruptcy..." 100 Iranians Die By Alcohol Poisoning After Ethanol Consumption For Virus "Cure" Over a thousand hospitalized after 'home remedy' rumor spreads on how to disinfect... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PhillipBlunt Posted March 19, 2020 Share Posted March 19, 2020 1 minute ago, nuckin_futz said: 15 Among Brazilian Delegation That Met With Trump Now Have Coronavirus General Augusto Heleno, 72, confirms he has coronavirus, along many others who traveled with Bolsonaro to Mar-a-Lago on March 7, Brazil's Globo newspaper reports. 'Please Stop Shooting Each Other': Baltimore Mayor Begs Residents To Keep Hospital Beds Clear For Coronavirus Patients "We cannot clog up our hospitals and their beds with people that are being shot senselessly." US Restaurant Association Projects Up To 7 Million Jobs Lost Over 3 Months Seeking $455 billion in total federal aid due to coronavirus hit... Tesla Employees Forced To Use Paid Time Off If Staying Home For Covid-19 Those who run out of PTO can "borrow" 80 hours from the company. How nice... 62% Of Americans Believe Media Has Exaggerated Covid-19 Risk, New Poll Shows Majority think press has overhyped the threat... Covid-19 Could Bankrupt Most Airlines By End Of May "...many airlines have probably already been driven into technical bankruptcy..." 100 Iranians Die By Alcohol Poisoning After Ethanol Consumption For Virus "Cure" Over a thousand hospitalized after 'home remedy' rumor spreads on how to disinfect... How can 62% of Americans be that irretrievably and categorically stupid beyond measure? 3 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EmilyM Posted March 19, 2020 Share Posted March 19, 2020 1 minute ago, PhillipBlunt said: How can 62% of Americans be that irretrievably and categorically stupid beyond measure? Probably because a lot of them watch a certain network's news that has been telling them such up until very recently 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
samurai Posted March 19, 2020 Share Posted March 19, 2020 2 minutes ago, nuckin_futz said: 15 Among Brazilian Delegation That Met With Trump Now Have Coronavirus General Augusto Heleno, 72, confirms he has coronavirus, along many others who traveled with Bolsonaro to Mar-a-Lago on March 7, Brazil's Globo newspaper reports. 'Please Stop Shooting Each Other': Baltimore Mayor Begs Residents To Keep Hospital Beds Clear For Coronavirus Patients "We cannot clog up our hospitals and their beds with people that are being shot senselessly." US Restaurant Association Projects Up To 7 Million Jobs Lost Over 3 Months Seeking $455 billion in total federal aid due to coronavirus hit... Tesla Employees Forced To Use Paid Time Off If Staying Home For Covid-19 Those who run out of PTO can "borrow" 80 hours from the company. How nice... 62% Of Americans Believe Media Has Exaggerated Covid-19 Risk, New Poll Shows Majority think press has overhyped the threat... Covid-19 Could Bankrupt Most Airlines By End Of May "...many airlines have probably already been driven into technical bankruptcy..." 100 Iranians Die By Alcohol Poisoning After Ethanol Consumption For Virus "Cure" Over a thousand hospitalized after 'home remedy' rumor spreads on how to disinfect... I talked to a friend yesterday in Vancouver. She has almost 20 staff in her 'firm'. She doesn't know if she can keep them. It's all fields. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post nuckin_futz Posted March 19, 2020 Popular Post Share Posted March 19, 2020 3 minutes ago, PhillipBlunt said: How can 62% of Americans be that irretrievably and categorically stupid beyond measure? The plague that is this man's stupidity is 2nd only to Covid-19. 2 1 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HI5 Posted March 19, 2020 Share Posted March 19, 2020 5 minutes ago, PhillipBlunt said: How can 62% of Americans be that irretrievably and categorically stupid beyond measure? 2/5 Americans believed Coronavirus was contracted from drinking Corona Beer. 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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