SCSF: (1) Vegas Golden Knights vs. (4) Montreal Canadiens | Canadiens win series 4-2

[sassbs]

1 hour ago, Dumb Nuck said:

Also shows how bad we really are finishing last in our division yet somehow Green is still a good coach.

[SirCosmoDuffGordon]

1 hour ago, 4petesake said:

He had a bit of a reputation (unfairly IMO) of not coming up big in the playoffs. Murray was in the net for their last two cups and add that to his contract and Pittsburgh made a large mistake.

It definitely was not unfair. He was at one point the worst playoff goalies of all-time. I would literally watch their games just to laugh at the pathetic goals he would let in. He cost the penguins cups. He had one solid year where they won the cup and then after they he just cost them cup after cup. He was atrocious. He would be great in the regular season and then literally could not stop a beach ball in the playoffs. It took a lot of sports psychology to finally get him playing at the same level he played at in the regular season in the playoffs. With that said in his final year with Pittsburg he proved he could play in the playoffs and that is when they left him for Vegas but with how Murray was playing letting him go seemed like the smart thing. 

[ShawnAntoski]

Outside of Price; Vegas checks all the boxes against the Habs (with the added bonus of a highly motivated ex Captain) and Vegas has MAF to match Price.

 

Lets see if the Zebras gets involved in the next few games to help extend the series (?).

Edited June 15, 2021 by ShawnAntoski

[4petesake]

4 minutes ago, SirCosmoDuffGordon said:

It definitely was not unfair. He was at one point the worst playoff goalies of all-time. I would literally watch their games just to laugh at the pathetic goals he would let in. He cost the penguins cups. He had one solid year where they won the cup and then after they he just cost them cup after cup. He was atrocious. He would be great in the regular season and then literally could not stop a beach ball in the playoffs. It took a lot of sports psychology to finally get him playing at the same level he played at in the regular season in the playoffs. With that said in his final year with Pittsburg he proved he could play in the playoffs and that is when they left him for Vegas but with how Murray was playing letting him go seemed like the smart thing. 

Thanks for that. You obviously have a much clearer recollection than I do of his days in Pittsburgh as I didn’t follow them very closely. That certainly makes it more understandable why they asked him to waive his NTC to go to Vegas.

[ShawnAntoski]

8 hours ago, SirCosmoDuffGordon said:

It definitely was not unfair. He was at one point the worst playoff goalies of all-time. I would literally watch their games just to laugh at the pathetic goals he would let in. He cost the penguins cups. He had one solid year where they won the cup and then after they he just cost them cup after cup. He was atrocious. He would be great in the regular season and then literally could not stop a beach ball in the playoffs. It took a lot of sports psychology to finally get him playing at the same level he played at in the regular season in the playoffs. With that said in his final year with Pittsburg he proved he could play in the playoffs and that is when they left him for Vegas but with how Murray was playing letting him go seemed like the smart thing. 

Good context on MAFs', earlier years in Pittsburgh.  With hindsight, MAF is still (very) productive and Murray seems to be going the other way - I remember Murrays hot start which is very comparable to Binnington.

Edited June 15, 2021 by ShawnAntoski

[Elias Pettersson]

So does this mean that Toffoli sucks now?

 

I guess playing against weak opposition all year padded his stats just a little bit.  I'm sure he will go back to being a 20 goal scorer next year and not on pace for 50...

[DeNiro]

Had to check Anderson’s stats again to make sure they were right…

 

He only has 1 goal and zero assists in 12 games. A career total of 9 points in 33 playoff games.

 

Im starting to see why Columbus let him go. That’s simply not good enough for a player like him who should thrive as the intensity ramps up.

 

 

[wallstreetamigo]

1 hour ago, Elias Pettersson said:

So does this mean that Toffoli sucks now?

 

I guess playing against weak opposition all year padded his stats just a little bit.  I'm sure he will go back to being a 20 goal scorer next year and not on pace for 50...

Hoping you are just being sarcastic here.

 

But too many people actually make this argument. To anyone who does, I say:

 

Yes, Jim Benning. One game against a tough team does mean he sucks and you made the right choice letting him go. The rest of the season and playoffs are definitely too small of a sample size vs one game.

 

Even if he did go back to being a 20 goal scorer, how is that actually worse than almost every player on the Canucks since few managed even 20 goals also against the weakest opposition in the league? Why not bring up how much they regressed against that weak competition? Oh ya they played a couple more games through the first month of the season and had covid. That doesnt explain the regression up until they got covid but hey its good enough for Benning supporters I guess.

 

Can we all just take the L on the Toffoli blunder instead of these reality-bending gymnastics designed to absolve Benning of any responsibility for a huge mistake?

 

Toffoli has been great for Montreal and is the furthest thing from being a negative or an issue there. 

Edited June 15, 2021 by wallstreetamigo

[iinatcc]

1 hour ago, Elias Pettersson said:

So does this mean that Toffoli sucks now?

 

I guess playing against weak opposition all year padded his stats just a little bit.  I'm sure he will go back to being a 20 goal scorer next year and not on pace for 50...

He's currently a point per game player in the series. So Toffoli is doing his thing 

[Elias Pettersson]

14 minutes ago, wallstreetamigo said:

Hoping you are just being sarcastic here.

 

But too many people actually make this argument. To anyone who does, I say:

 

Yes, Jim Benning. One game against a tough team does mean he sucks and you made the right choice letting him go. The rest of the season and playoffs are definitely too small of a sample size vs one game.

 

Even if he did go back to being a 20 goal scorer, how is that actually worse than almost every player on the Canucks since few managed even 20 goals also against the weakest opposition in the league? Why not bring up how much they regressed against that weak competition? Oh ya they played a couple more games through the first month of the season and had covid. That doesnt explain the regression up until they got covid but hey its good enough for Benning supporters I guess.

 

Can we all just take the L on the Toffoli blunder instead of these reality-bending gymnastics designed to absolve Benning of any responsibility for a huge mistake?

 

Toffoli has been great for Montreal and is the furthest thing from being a negative or an issue there. 

I wouldn't use this season to judge any player.  Next year we will see where everybody is at.  As for Toffoli, I am sure he will go back to reality and be a 20 goal scorer next year, I don't think it is possible to have a renaissance at 29 years old and all of a sudden go from 20 to 50 goals.  Don't think it has every happened in hockey history.

 

A huge mistake is trading a top pairing Dman for the next French superstar who may be out of the league in 2 years, not trading for a rental at the deadline to make a playoff push and then not re-sign him in the summer.  But I guess we differ on what the definition of a huge mistake is so I'll leave it at that.

[wallstreetamigo]

1 minute ago, Elias Pettersson said:

I wouldn't use this season to judge any player.  Next year we will see where everybody is at.  As for Toffoli, I am sure he will go back to reality and be a 20 goal scorer next year, I don't think it is possible to have a renaissance at 29 years old and all of a sudden go from 20 to 50 goals.  Don't think it has every happened in hockey history.

 

A huge mistake is trading a top pairing Dman for the next French superstar who may be out of the league in 2 years, not trading for a rental at the deadline to make a playoff push and then not re-sign him in the summer.  But I guess we differ on what the definition of a huge mistake is so I'll leave it at that.

He probably will regress from being on pace for 50 goals. But how many Canucks players even scored 20?

 

Like I said, trading for Toffoli at the deadline only made any sense at all if they kept him. Letting him walk amounts to trading him, plus the assets traded for him, for absolutely nothing that helps the team going forward. Sorry but for a consistent bottom of the league team that is just ridiculous asset management and a huge mistake.

 

Comparing it to a terrible 1 for 1 trade is apples and oranges. Drouin may suck but at least the habs were left with something longer term. Still a completely crappy trade though. But nothing similar to a clear waste of assets to rent a guy when your team is not even close to being good enough to win a cup.

 

Sugar coat it however you want. Toffoli had a monster season and, combined with Benning's own ran out of time comments, made Benning look like an absolute tool.

[Hairy Kneel]

Vegas looks too strong for Montreal. 

As long as they keep hitting Gallagher, Taffoli, Suzuki and Caulfield they should take care of the Habs early. 

 

[Alflives]

7 hours ago, ShawnAntoski said:

Outside of Price; Vegas checks all the boxes against the Habs (with a highly motivated ex Captain) and Vegas has MAF to match Price.

 

Lets see if the Zebras gets involved in the next few games to extend the series (?).

Series management?  I can definitely see that happening.  Habs like Caufield, Tofoli, Suzuki generate no offence 5 on 5.  Especially Caufield.  Guy is 100% a perimeter player.  Cute as a bug though.  

[JM_]

4 hours ago, Hairy Kneel said:

Vegas looks too strong for Montreal. 

As long as they keep hitting Gallagher, Taffoli, Suzuki and Caulfield they should take care of the Habs early. 

 

MTL looked pretty good for the first 10-12 minutes, you can see how Vegas might really struggle against Tampa or NYI who will be able to play that way for a full 60. 

[Elias Pettersson]

6 hours ago, wallstreetamigo said:

He probably will regress from being on pace for 50 goals. But how many Canucks players even scored 20?

 

Like I said, trading for Toffoli at the deadline only made any sense at all if they kept him. Letting him walk amounts to trading him, plus the assets traded for him, for absolutely nothing that helps the team going forward. Sorry but for a consistent bottom of the league team that is just ridiculous asset management and a huge mistake.

 

Comparing it to a terrible 1 for 1 trade is apples and oranges. Drouin may suck but at least the habs were left with something longer term. Still a completely crappy trade though. But nothing similar to a clear waste of assets to rent a guy when your team is not even close to being good enough to win a cup.

 

Sugar coat it however you want. Toffoli had a monster season and, combined with Benning's own ran out of time comments, made Benning look like an absolute tool.

The top Canuck players are all young. Hoglander was a rookie. Podkolzin hasn’t even arrived yet. Pettersson was injured half the year.  Boeser got 23 goals. Only 5 short of Toffoli’s once in a lifetime year. Bo was at 19 goals. Miller was his usual self almost at an 80 point pace.  Are you suggesting these are bad numbers?  Not to mention they all got COVID with 20 games left to play. 
 

I’m not concerned at all with the forward group moving forward. Same with the goaltending. Demko is already better than Price. It’s the defence that needs fixing. That’s why Benning brought in Brad Shaw. He’s a defensive guru. 
 

Let’s see what Shaw does with the overall defensive play of the team next year. I have a feeling we are gonna be much better. Adding a couple big bodies at the back will also help. Let’s see what Benning has up his sleeve. 
 

I can guarantee you we won’t be missing Toffoli next year. You will even forget he exists. 

[ShawnAntoski]

39 minutes ago, Jimmy McGill said:

MTL looked pretty good for the first 10-12 minutes, you can see how Vegas might really struggle against Tampa or NYI who will be able to play that way for a full 60. 

Yeah, just like the Canucks: when the opposing coach makes there in game adjustments, the Habs struggled - the game of chess or checkers in our case; hope Shaw is good at chess (?).

Edited June 15, 2021 by ShawnAntoski

[johngould21]

6 hours ago, wallstreetamigo said:

He probably will regress from being on pace for 50 goals. But how many Canucks players even scored 20?

 

Like I said, trading for Toffoli at the deadline only made any sense at all if they kept him. Letting him walk amounts to trading him, plus the assets traded for him, for absolutely nothing that helps the team going forward. Sorry but for a consistent bottom of the league team that is just ridiculous asset management and a huge mistake.

 

Comparing it to a terrible 1 for 1 trade is apples and oranges. Drouin may suck but at least the habs were left with something longer term. Still a completely crappy trade though. But nothing similar to a clear waste of assets to rent a guy when your team is not even close to being good enough to win a cup.

 

Sugar coat it however you want. Toffoli had a monster season and, combined with Benning's own ran out of time comments, made Benning look like an absolute tool.

Boeser had 23 on a team that was raked through the coals with Covid. I did wish that Toffoli was resigned, but he was brought in last year to fill the gap for Boeser who was out with injury. 

[JM_]

24 minutes ago, ShawnAntoski said:

Yeah, just like the Canucks: when the opposing coach makes there in game adjustments, the Habs struggled - the game of chess or checkers in our case; hope Shaw is good at chess (?).

opposing coaches had to make adjustments? 

 

/s

[JM_]

24 minutes ago, johngould21 said:

Boeser had 23 on a team that was raked through the coals with Covid. I did wish that Toffoli was resigned, but he was brought in last year to fill the gap for Boeser who was out with injury. 

Hey buddy, don't bring facts into this. 

[Hairy Kneel]

54 minutes ago, ShawnAntoski said:

Yeah, just like the Canucks: when the opposing coach makes there in game adjustments, the Habs struggled - the game of chess or checkers in our case; hope Shaw is good at chess (?).

Vegas switched their line match ups to control their energy line. A good coaching move. Easier with last change.