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[discussion] Canucks first line


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I think this is a serious ?

 

The Canucks we’re so good during the Sedins prime because that first line could absolutely drive play and produce.

 

Do BB, EP, JM have what it takes to be a true first line moving forward? 
 

I would argue BB is a natural scorer a lot like Toffoli, and maybe not quite as good off puck like TT is. I just don’t know if the Canucks can extract the kind of value they will need out of BB given his cap hit now and later.

 

EP is such an enigma. I would be more certain about him if he showed that 2 way play that made me really believe in him in the first place. I think that 2 way play and face off strength are absolutely vital for a 1st line C. He’s a competitor, driven and has the natural ability, so I think he can get there.  

 

Miller is a play driver and in his prime, although off to a slow start.  That could easily be a product of line chemistry though.  Part of me would be OK having Miller extended, but if it’s going to be with EP/BB I’m not so sure.  Imagine him with Eichel as his C or another similar play driver/big body-they would dominate. So although I’m sold on Miller, I don’t know how he fits composition wise.  He needs to have other play drivers as linemates to be effective.  
 

IMO, I would move BB to try and fine a winger that can better compliment EP/JM. 

 

 

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10 minutes ago, Angry Goose said:

I would argue BB is a natural scorer a lot like Toffoli, and maybe not quite as good off puck like TT is. I just don’t know if the Canucks can extract the kind of value they will need out of BB given his cap hit now and later.

Boeser had all that hype in his first year of being that amazing scorer maybe being capable of 50 goals at some point, but I don't see that happening. 

 

His development has sort of stagnated since that explosive first year. I still think he is a first line calibre player. Albeit, a 1B/2A type player for that role.

I remember in his draft there was some comparisons to Patrick Sharp and IMO, that's exactly the type of player he will end up being like in terms of production. 

Edited by PetterssonOrPeterson
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3 minutes ago, PetterssonOrPeterson said:

 

Boeser had all that hype in his first year of being that amazing scorer maybe being capable of 50 goals at some point, but I don't see that happening. 

 

His development has sort of stagnated since that explosive first year. I still think he is a first line calibre player. Albeit, a 1B/2A type player for that role. I remember in his draft there was some comparisons to Patrick Sharp and IMO, that's exactly the type of player he will end up being like. 

Sharp is an interesting comparable. 

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31 minutes ago, PetterssonOrPeterson said:

 

Boeser had all that hype in his first year of being that amazing scorer maybe being capable of 50 goals at some point, but I don't see that happening. 

 

His development has sort of stagnated since that explosive first year. I still think he is a first line calibre player. Albeit, a 1B/2A type player for that role.

I remember in his draft there was some comparisons to Patrick Sharp and IMO, that's exactly the type of player he will end up being like in terms of production. 

He played the best hockey of his career last season.  He was one of the few bright spots.

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Well I like Boeser. And his performance is decent, been on pace to average 30+ goals per season last 3 out of 4 seasons. Technically, if you can score 30 goals, you are first line material. Hes 24 already, if he was some superstar, he would have been exploding for the past couple of years. Since it didn't happen,  everyone's just gotta dial back their expectations. 

 

Pettersson looks totally lost this season. In fact to me, he looked Gretzky-like for like 60 games in his first season and has dropped down several levels since. Sure, he racks up points at a ppg pace. Many of his goals are now just diving for loose pucks. I haven't seen something amazing from him in long while. The fact that he tries so hard to be a two-way player always backchecking so hard actually tells me that he knows himself he has overachieved offensively. 

 

Miller.. I dont know. Definitely a 1st line player, but he seems carefree. 

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Miller is the one that's out of the rest of our core's age group, and he'll be looking for a retirement contract when his current deal is up. Those contracts don't typically age very well.

 

Miller is the one that should be moved. I'd even argue that Petey should be moved ahead of Boeser, as with Boeser we have a good idea of what we'll be getting year after year. He's been remarkably consistent and is coming off of his best season, whereas Pettersson seems to be trending downwards. Unfortunately, I don't see Pettersson improving much as the years go by. His slight frame simply won't allow for it to happen. He's never going to be a legitimate top line center.

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Based on league stats, we don't have a "1st line". 

 

Based on % F/A and goals for /against, our top performing pairs/lines are ...

 

67th         Ekmann-Larsson/Myers  (67th)

104th       Pearson-Horvat-Garland (who has been demoted by Green)

109th       Rathbone Burroughs

118th        Hughes - Poolman

 

OUCH!!

 

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Well..............Hmmm

 

I have been on the fence with Green, but after reading these comments

 

I just think he is not getting enough out of some very good hockey players

 

Now, you can blame one or even 2, but to be honest, there are too many players

 

playing under their  capabilities..............that screams coaching

 

So I think it is fair to say, that before we start shipping guys out for real

 

Which, unless its a hockey trade, I don't think we should do

 

I think a whole sale coaching change is the first place we go...........

 

Maybe Benning too, as a coach is a reflection of the GM to some extent

 

Sad to say it!

 

 

(Note* This is actually how I feel and not just a proposal I post for fun)

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4 minutes ago, J.I.A.H.N said:

Well..............Hmmm

 

I have been on the fence with Green, but after reading these comments

 

I just think he is not getting enough out of some very good hockey players

 

Now, you can blame one or even 2, but to be honest, there are too many players

 

playing under their  capabilities..............that screams coaching

 

So I think it is fair to say, that before we start shipping guys out for real

 

Which, unless its a hockey trade, I don't think we should do

 

I think a whole sale coaching change is the first place we go...........

 

Maybe Benning too, as a coach is a reflection of the GM to some extent

 

Sad to say it!

 

 

(Note* This is actually how I feel and not just a proposal I post for fun)

They literally just extended his contract for 2 years back in May.  I doubt you’ll see a coaching change unless things go completely off the rails 

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1 minute ago, qwijibo said:

They literally just extended his contract for 2 years back in May.  I doubt you’ll see a coaching change unless things go completely off the rails 

Define "completely off the rails", but I do agree, it is not happening tomorrow, but 20 games in, if it does not look good...........all bets are off

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3 hours ago, Angry Goose said:

I think this is a serious ?

 

The Canucks we’re so good during the Sedins prime because that first line could absolutely drive play and produce.

 

Do BB, EP, JM have what it takes to be a true first line moving forward? 
 

I would argue BB is a natural scorer a lot like Toffoli, and maybe not quite as good off puck like TT is. I just don’t know if the Canucks can extract the kind of value they will need out of BB given his cap hit now and later.

 

EP is such an enigma. I would be more certain about him if he showed that 2 way play that made me really believe in him in the first place. I think that 2 way play and face off strength are absolutely vital for a 1st line C. He’s a competitor, driven and has the natural ability, so I think he can get there.  

 

Miller is a play driver and in his prime, although off to a slow start.  That could easily be a product of line chemistry though.  Part of me would be OK having Miller extended, but if it’s going to be with EP/BB I’m not so sure.  Imagine him with Eichel as his C or another similar play driver/big body-they would dominate. So although I’m sold on Miller, I don’t know how he fits composition wise.  He needs to have other play drivers as linemates to be effective.  
 

IMO, I would move BB to try and fine a winger that can better compliment EP/JM. 

 

 

Good points. Although I think Boesers

two-way IQ and puck retrieval is actually the most underrated part of his game. It’s as good if not better than Toffolis. Toffoli is also older than Boeser and came into the league on a cup winning team. Toffoli took a bit to really get going and I think Boeser will be the same and will get even better. Pettersson will definitely be 1st line material and already is. In fact he will be borderline elite once he fully forms. Millers all around game, powerful speed, and fiery attitude all make him a 1st liner. I think right now the 1st line is enough but our depth and overall game is what needs to be handled properly to get a cup. And also the future picture is what really paints our 1st line and we should be focusing on making sure we develop it into that. IMO it should be and I see it as..

 

Podkolzin -Pettersson- Klimovich

(followed and rotated in by)

Hoglander -Horvat- Boeser

Plasek -Dickinson- Garland

McDonough -Focht- Lockwood

 

 

 

 

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3 hours ago, 48MPHSlapShot said:

Miller is the one that's out of the rest of our core's age group, and he'll be looking for a retirement contract when his current deal is up. Those contracts don't typically age very well.

 

Miller is the one that should be moved. I'd even argue that Petey should be moved ahead of Boeser, as with Boeser we have a good idea of what we'll be getting year after year. He's been remarkably consistent and is coming off of his best season, whereas Pettersson seems to be trending downwards. Unfortunately, I don't see Pettersson improving much as the years go by. His slight frame simply won't allow for it to happen. He's never going to be a legitimate top line center.

Agree that we should move Miller rather than handing him a contract that takes him to age 35.

 

But you serious about EP?

 

EP has been producing like a legitimate first liner since the day he came into the league. Even last season, he went on a PPG pace after setting the record on the number of posts hit in the first x number of games.

 

This is the first time he's struggled to generate offence and the problem may not be him because the whole team is underperforming, except Demko. Like the whole team is struggling...  

 

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6 hours ago, Angry Goose said:

I think this is a serious ?

 

The Canucks we’re so good during the Sedins prime because that first line could absolutely drive play and produce.

 

Do BB, EP, JM have what it takes to be a true first line moving forward? 
 

I would argue BB is a natural scorer a lot like Toffoli, and maybe not quite as good off puck like TT is. I just don’t know if the Canucks can extract the kind of value they will need out of BB given his cap hit now and later.

 

EP is such an enigma. I would be more certain about him if he showed that 2 way play that made me really believe in him in the first place. I think that 2 way play and face off strength are absolutely vital for a 1st line C. He’s a competitor, driven and has the natural ability, so I think he can get there.  

 

Miller is a play driver and in his prime, although off to a slow start.  That could easily be a product of line chemistry though.  Part of me would be OK having Miller extended, but if it’s going to be with EP/BB I’m not so sure.  Imagine him with Eichel as his C or another similar play driver/big body-they would dominate. So although I’m sold on Miller, I don’t know how he fits composition wise.  He needs to have other play drivers as linemates to be effective.  
 

IMO, I would move BB to try and fine a winger that can better compliment EP/JM. 

 

 

One thing that surprises me is how Green hasn't tried the Hoglander-Miller-Boeser line as of yet.  

 

If you recall, the Canucks went 8-3-2 post Petey injury last year before the Canucks-covid broke out.  It was the Canucks' best stretch of hockey last season and this line was leading the way.  I would even go as far as saying that if the Canucks hadn't had that covid outbreak last season, the Canucks might have caught up to 4th place.  

 

Anyways, I'd try this:

 

Pettersson-Horvat-Garland

Hoglander-Miller-Boeser

Pearson-Dickinson-Bailey

Highmore-Lammiko-Chiasson

 

Podkolzin to Abby.

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