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Hirsch: "...the problem isn't on the bench, the problem is in the locker room..."

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R3aL Canucks Star

R3aL

Posted
Posted
5 hours ago, 48MPHSlapShot said:

I have no clue what type of access he has tbh.

 

That said, if we were to assume it was true, and Miller is the guy not buying in, isn't it the coaches job to ensure he and everyone else does buy in? Or at the very least relay to the GM that Miller is undermining him and needs to go?

 

However you want to look at it, Green isn't doing his job if one player has more power over the locker room than he does.

He’s travelling with the team. He’s around them, and he’s a former player. So direct access.

 

He did say he’s gotta get himself off the air and travel with these guys so better get off before he says too much out of anger.


I’m okay with the emotion. He’s disappointed and so are all of us.

 

but I think there is some level of truth to his emotional comments. 
 

something is clearly wrong with our group psychologically, culturally etc 

 

what we are doing right now isn’t working and maybe a new coach could spark the change needed for the players. 

 

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-DLC- Canucks Hall-of-Famer

-DLC-

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1 hour ago, Crabcakes said:

I can tell you're a bit of a Miller fan.  I think he's a bit of a prima donna and a showboat.  All the F-bombs and door slamming during games tells me it's more about him and less about the team.  He can be a great player in the right situation clearly but since the playoff success in the bubble the Canucks have lost most of their leadership group:  Marky, Tanev, Edler, Stecher, and Sutter.  It's not the same team any more.  

 

The whole situation is really frustrating.  I wasn't meaning to criticize you in particular or single you out.  I don't know what they need to do.  Firing the coach may shake things up and it may work out.  I still don't think they have the depth.  The players still have to play.  No coach can get out there and do it for them.  So in that respect Hirsch is right.  Turing over half the team in 1 year doesn't help with team identity either.  I guess it's really a combination of GM, Coach and players.  

Thing is...no matter what he is personality wise, he's producing.  He's one of very few.  So I don't think he's the problem right now, I tend to think he's more of the solution.

 

The coach can't play for them but if the coach is insisting they play a way that isn't suited to their strengths and is stifling their natural skill and ability, he's got to go.  And I'm starting to wonder if that's the case.  Players come in showing skill and creativity and then it's ... gone.  It seems it's possibly connected to me.

 

It is frustrating.  But I know this team IS too soft to play against and I'm really hard pressed to get rid of ANY players because they're abrasive...just have them channel that on to the ice (and Miller does).  We have to have a team that can take it...not shrivel up.  Miller's a bit of a hardnose for sure...I welcome that at this point. 

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-DLC- Canucks Hall-of-Famer

-DLC-

Posted
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7 minutes ago, R3aL said:

He’s travelling with the team. He’s around them, and he’s a former player. So direct access.

 

He did say he’s gotta get himself off the air and travel with these guys so better get off before he says too much out of anger.


I’m okay with the emotion. He’s disappointed and so are all of us.

 

but I think there is some level of truth to his emotional comments. 
 

something is clearly wrong with our group psychologically, culturally etc 

 

what we are doing right now isn’t working and maybe a new coach could spark the change needed for the players. 

 

But he also says it's not the coach or gm.

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J.I.A.H.N Canucks Franchise Player

J.I.A.H.N

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Well, here is my take on this................

 

If there is a problem, either in coaching or in the player ranks

 

It is up to the GM and the coach to identify it and fix it

 

If a system is causing problems for so many talented players, then you have to change the system

 

If a player (singular) is causing a problem, then you must change the player

 

But in either case, it is the GM's responsibility to be able to fix the problem.

 

Do not think for a minute, that the majority of players are all slumping because they are all having off years

 

When players want out...........aka Schmidt, who came from a very tight team (Vegas), then you have to ask why he wants out

 

When that player succeeds after leaving the team, then you have to ask why, and why he did not when here

 

It is a very dysfunctional team right now, and it is the GM's responsibility to find out and correct it

 

If he can not, then he is the wrong GM

 

This is where Aqualini needs a president of hockey operations, who can council him and the GM

 

Aqualini has absolutely no professional sports experience, and I wonder who he gets his advise from?

 

And please don't tell the Sedin's :picard: Who have exactly the same amount of professional sports  management experience as Aqualini

 

This is a very dysfunctional team right now.....................

 

PS.......................I would be demanding Hirsh be barred from any contact from the team.

 

He has now become part of the problem....

 

 

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J.I.A.H.N Canucks Franchise Player

J.I.A.H.N

Posted
Posted (edited)

Well, here is my take on this................

 

If there is a problem, either in coaching or in the player ranks

 

It is up to the GM and the coach to identify it and fix it

 

If a system is causing problems for so many talented players, then you have to change the system

 

If a player (singular) is causing a problem, then you must change the player

 

But in either case, it is the GM's responsibility to be able to fix the problem.

 

Do not think for a minute, that the majority of players are all slumping because they are all having off years

 

When players want out...........aka Schmidt, who came from a very tight team (Vegas), then you have to ask why he wants out

 

When that player succeeds after leaving the team, then you have to ask why, and why he did not when here

 

It is a very dysfunctional team right now, and it is the GM's responsibility to find out and correct it

 

If he can not, then he is the wrong GM

 

This is where Aqualini needs a president of hockey operations, who can council him and the GM

 

Aqualini has absolutely no professional sports experience, and I wonder who he gets his advise from?

 

And please don't tell the Sedin's :picard: Who have exactly the same amount of professional sports  management experience as Aqualini

 

This is a very dysfunctional team right now.....................

 

PS.......................I would be demanding Hirsh be barred from any contact from the team.

 

He has now become part of the problem....This is a mess!

 

 

Edited by J.I.A.H.N
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Vinny in Vancouver Canucks Regular

Vinny in Vancouver

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9 minutes ago, -DLC- said:

But he also says it's not the coach or gm.

That maybe the most revealing part of what he said. If it's not the coach or the GM, then how can one person be having such a detrimental effect on the whole team's success? Basically, it has to be someone there on 5-on-5, PK and PP. The only player that qualifies is Miller, unfortunately.

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VegasCanuck Canucks Star

VegasCanuck

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5 hours ago, JM_ said:

If he's talking about Miller, it doesn't make sense... 17 pts in 15 games. If he's doing that while not buying into the system, maybe its the system?

Don't know who he's talking about, but in any organization, you have to have valid chain of leadership. If one guy is not falling in line, you have to remove him from the lineup. If you don't, they will think that they can do it whenever they want, and you will accomplish nothing as a team, no matter how much talent you have.

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Fakename70 Canucks Prospect

Fakename70

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6 hours ago, 48MPHSlapShot said:

Not agreeing or disagreeing with him, I'd just like to know how he knows this.

I've never been convinced that he does. He just never misses an opportunity to interject his own personal experience as an NHL player. Granted, he has that over probably everyone registered at this board, but, he just seems to hold that over the head of the listener even when it isn't REALLY appropriate or relevant. And, it REALLY grinds my gears that he's always bagging on Miller. I mean, it's constant. That was my feeling as I listened to his rant last night. That he was referring specifically to - but, without having the guts to actually say - J.T. Miller. as the root cause of what ails the Vancouver Canucks. 

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Fakename70 Canucks Prospect

Fakename70

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2 hours ago, Crabcakes said:

Miller has all the leverage because he's the leading scorer.  Benning would lose a lot of cred if he moved him.  Also, Green would lose cred if he cut his ice time.  He also loses cred if he admits to his GM that he is having a hard time with a player and may be losing the room

GMJB and Green have "cred"?

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Fakename70 Canucks Prospect

Fakename70

Posted
Posted
27 minutes ago, Vinny in Vancouver said:

That maybe the most revealing part of what he said. If it's not the coach or the GM, then how can one person be having such a detrimental effect on the whole team's success? Basically, it has to be someone there on 5-on-5, PK and PP. The only player that qualifies is Miller, unfortunately.

But, he also said that changing the coach without also changing the players - 1 in particular - would produce the same result as what we're seeing now. You cannot ever convince me that this exact same group would also be just as miserable to watch under Mike Babcock as they've been under Travis Green. Anyone "close to the team" who honestly believes that really doesn't know what they're talking about, and, maybe, ultimately just has an axe-to-grind against that 1 specific player, for whatever reason. 

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ABNucksfan Canucks Prospect

ABNucksfan

Posted
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5 hours ago, -DLC- said:

So wait.

 

The "expert" on our woes is a goaltender whose own records was:  34W - 45L?  With a 3.13 GAA?  

 

Corey loves to talk, but it doesn't mean it's all worth listening to or of any value/substance.  

 

Sometimes teams need an alpha to step up if they're floundering...I have no problem with this (at all).  It's called leadership.  You can't coddle players for too long...sometimes you've gotta bring some tough love in (too).  I've been a big proponent of "patience" and "allowing players to work through", but that's not fair to teammates if it goes on too long.

 

I don't know that they should buy into a system that hasn't provided them with proven results.   The guys who are "broken" right now showed great instinctual talent...maybe this is being coached out of some?  Because some move on the find that success (again) elsewhere.  And the alphas seem to be doing ok despite it all.  That speaks volumes for me.

 

 

How many games have you played in the NHL deb? 
 

Not saying I like Hirsch but there is clearly something wrong with this team. 
 

No such thing as an alpha dog and if we have players walking around the dressing room like they are alpha dogs then the team has issues…

 

A coach who has the guts to bench and demote slacker players like Pettersson is a coach that is needed. 
 

Pettersson playing like he doesn’t gaf and laughing all the way to the bank and still getting 18+ minutes a night,

 

Podz, Garland, Hogs and other hard working players getting less than 10 minutes a night after scoring 2 goals is and issue.
 

Green must go, so must Benning. And A coach who has guts to bench the  so called “star” players who don’t want to play hard needs to be brought in. 

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canuckleheads fan Canucks Prospect

canuckleheads fan

Posted
Posted
4 hours ago, Elias Pettersson said:

Juice doesn't seem to buy into what Hirsch is saying.  I think he knows more about what has gone on in Vancouver than Hirsch.

I would suggest the opposite is true. He doesn't cover the team closely, doesn't travel with them, probably doesn't talk to anyone from the franchise regularly. The only player who is still there from Bieksa's last season is Bo, and that was his rookie season. So it is highly doubtful that Juice would have better insight into the room and the daily temperature of the team than Hirsch.  IF Bo is the Alpha Dog that Hirsch is alluding to, do you think Bo would give him a neutral assessment of what's going on?

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