Elias Pettersson Posted May 1, 2023 Author Share Posted May 1, 2023 UPDATE: The winner of the Frank Selke Trophy for the 2022-2023 season will be announced tomorrow, May 2... 2023 NHL Awards finalists to be announced starting Tuesday 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Podz92 Posted May 1, 2023 Share Posted May 1, 2023 On 4/29/2023 at 12:32 PM, nergish said: Luongo = Bure = H/D. Sedin = Pettersson = Hughes I don't see how you could argue that any one was/is "better" than the other We've been fortunate to see several great players wear Canucks colors over the years... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IBatch Posted May 1, 2023 Share Posted May 1, 2023 (edited) 3 hours ago, Baggins said: Clutch and grab hockey goes way back. Gretzky complained about so much in the early 80's he got the nickname Whine Gretzky. What really changed in the late 90's was the rise in teams employing the trap. Add a lot of clutch and grab to the trap and it stifled offense. One thing that could get through it was speed. Bure had that in spades. Where you really saw the drop in high scoring was the 96/97 season with only 2 players putting up 100+. points down from 12 players the season before. Without checking, i'm pretty sure the last boffo season where a dozen or so guys scored well over 100 points was 1994. Federov and Gretzky leading the pack. Then we had a lockout. NJ had already gained a ton of traction and SJ adopted their style right away. Upset Detroit i think twice. And they were monsters before they finally won a cup, going back to 1993 or so. Dead puck era had a definitive line as far as scoring drop, and that was 1994. As for Wayne. It was actually Mario, Roenick and Hull leading the charge about that stuff. I don't re-call Gretzky ever complaining about anything in the 80's expect he called out NJ Devils once, and called them a joke of a franchise. For sure he used his eventual stardom to intimidate refs as a tactic though. Don't remember him getting the moniker "whine Gretzky" for clutch and grab early on in the 80's lol. And for sure it was a tough rough era he played in back then too. As for speed. Go and check out a 17 year vet Gartner when he was the commish'es choice and see what sort of times those guys had. They had to qualify. Low 13's. As whole lot of them and they didn't get to start and then get timed either. Bure was one of a kind. Federov was fast too. Hedican was part of it mid 13's...Selanne. There were a ton of fast players back then, Bure wasn't just about speed. He was unique. Even Messier scored almost 50 goals just before he came to Vancouver. For me the dead puck era was more than just bad timing for athletes. That's obvious because as soon as it was lifted guys who were in the mid 30's exploded like Zubov. Heck Sakic scored over 100 at 37. And Alfie had his best seasons too. It was also about lack of emerging talent. Edited May 1, 2023 by IBatch 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
burrowsalex14 Posted May 2, 2023 Share Posted May 2, 2023 5 hours ago, Elias Pettersson said: UPDATE: The winner of the Frank Selke Trophy for the 2022-2023 season will be announced tomorrow, May 2... 2023 NHL Awards finalists to be announced starting Tuesday Winner or just the nominees? It says award show is in June 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tas Posted May 2, 2023 Share Posted May 2, 2023 5 hours ago, Elias Pettersson said: UPDATE: The winner of the Frank Selke Trophy for the 2022-2023 season will be announced tomorrow, May 2... 2023 NHL Awards finalists to be announced starting Tuesday just the finalists, not the winner. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TopChed Posted May 2, 2023 Share Posted May 2, 2023 He really otter win the selkie. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
86Viking Posted May 2, 2023 Share Posted May 2, 2023 On 4/29/2023 at 11:32 AM, nergish said: Luongo = Bure = H/D. Sedin = Pettersson = Hughes I don't see how you could argue that any one was/is "better" than the other Let's see if those last 2 players can bring a Stanley Cup to Vancouver...Whatever player puts the Canucks on his back and does that for this team gets Legendary status!!! 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
24K PureCool Posted May 2, 2023 Share Posted May 2, 2023 8 hours ago, Elias Pettersson said: UPDATE: The winner of the Frank Selke Trophy for the 2022-2023 season will be announced tomorrow, May 2... 2023 NHL Awards finalists to be announced starting Tuesday If Petey is not in the running for the Lady Byng. I'm gonna raise my fist in anger. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Baggins Posted May 2, 2023 Share Posted May 2, 2023 10 hours ago, IBatch said: Without checking, i'm pretty sure the last boffo season where a dozen or so guys scored well over 100 points was 1994. Federov and Gretzky leading the pack. Then we had a lockout. NJ had already gained a ton of traction and SJ adopted their style right away. Upset Detroit i think twice. And they were monsters before they finally won a cup, going back to 1993 or so. Dead puck era had a definitive line as far as scoring drop, and that was 1994. As for Wayne. It was actually Mario, Roenick and Hull leading the charge about that stuff. I don't re-call Gretzky ever complaining about anything in the 80's expect he called out NJ Devils once, and called them a joke of a franchise. For sure he used his eventual stardom to intimidate refs as a tactic though. Don't remember him getting the moniker "whine Gretzky" for clutch and grab early on in the 80's lol. And for sure it was a tough rough era he played in back then too. As for speed. Go and check out a 17 year vet Gartner when he was the commish'es choice and see what sort of times those guys had. They had to qualify. Low 13's. As whole lot of them and they didn't get to start and then get timed either. Bure was one of a kind. Federov was fast too. Hedican was part of it mid 13's...Selanne. There were a ton of fast players back then, Bure wasn't just about speed. He was unique. Even Messier scored almost 50 goals just before he came to Vancouver. For me the dead puck era was more than just bad timing for athletes. That's obvious because as soon as it was lifted guys who were in the mid 30's exploded like Zubov. Heck Sakic scored over 100 at 37. And Alfie had his best seasons too. It was also about lack of emerging talent. I was a father of two when Gretzky came in the league. Believe me, he got the "Whine" Gretzky nickname because he complained so much about getting hooked and grabbed. That was years before Mario was drafted. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IBatch Posted May 2, 2023 Share Posted May 2, 2023 (edited) 3 hours ago, Baggins said: I was a father of two when Gretzky came in the league. Believe me, he got the "Whine" Gretzky nickname because he complained so much about getting hooked and grabbed. That was years before Mario was drafted. Scoring had been trending down since 1992-1993... No debate the game was grabby back then too (80's), but not as grabby as it became. Semenko at least kept him from getting clocked (although players did try, was hard to hit) Sather - "hitting Gretz is like trying to hit smoke" etc. When Mario was out, Jagr's points usually took a hit. Compare that to this, hard to fit all the scoring on one page lol...and it had been like that since the late 70's...81 was actually the peak. Respect to you old timer - your right 95/96 was still a year where guys got their points ... Mario left. Jagr did keep it up, but never reached those heights again. Edited May 2, 2023 by IBatch 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kevin Biestra Posted May 2, 2023 Share Posted May 2, 2023 (edited) 8 minutes ago, IBatch said: Scoring had been trending down since 1992-1993... No debate the game was grabby back then too (80's), but not as grabby as it became. Semenko at least kept him from getting clocked (although players did try, was hard to hit) Sather - "hitting Gretz is like trying to hit smoke" etc. When Mario was out, Jagr's points usually took a hit. Compare that to this, hard to fit all the scoring on one page lol...and it had been like that since the late 70's...81 was actually the peak. That was a fun season to watch. They made a pretty good video game for the PC with the stats from that season as well. Damn Cliff Ronning couldn't stay on his feet if anyone touched him...they gave him the attributes of a housefly. Al MacInnis could break Gretzky's 92 goal season with PPG alone if you put him on the wing on the PP for one timers. A lot of asterisks on that scoring chart. Should be a few more as well like Mogilny, Turgeon, Roenick and Fleury...and coach Tocchet is a hell of a lot closer to a Hall of Famer than most people think. Kevin Stevens...suffers from Charlie Simmer / Rick Martin / Tim Kerr syndrome I guess. An absolute legend for a handful of seasons but didn't do it for long enough. Edited May 2, 2023 by Kevin Biestra 1 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alflives Posted May 2, 2023 Share Posted May 2, 2023 33 minutes ago, Kevin Biestra said: That was a fun season to watch. They made a pretty good video game for the PC with the stats from that season as well. Damn Cliff Ronning couldn't stay on his feet if anyone touched him...they gave him the attributes of a housefly. Al MacInnis could break Gretzky's 92 goal season with PPG alone if you put him on the wing on the PP for one timers. A lot of asterisks on that scoring chart. Should be a few more as well like Mogilny, Turgeon, Roenick and Fleury...and coach Tocchet is a hell of a lot closer to a Hall of Famer than most people think. Kevin Stevens...suffers from Charlie Simmer / Rick Martin / Tim Kerr syndrome I guess. An absolute legend for a handful of seasons but didn't do it for long enough. Different stick technology then too. A player had to actually have the wrist strength and skill to shoot the puck. Now every player uses a super special stick, that flexes perfectly for them, so the can shoot hard and accurate. 1 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IBatch Posted May 2, 2023 Share Posted May 2, 2023 (edited) 7 minutes ago, Alflives said: Different stick technology then too. A player had to actually have the wrist strength and skill to shoot the puck. Now every player uses a super special stick, that flexes perfectly for them, so the can shoot hard and accurate. You bet... Al Mac and Al Ifrate, Wilson ... could murder that puck with wood...Some guys like Al Mac never changed into the hybrids which had more flex ... Wendel Clark breaking masks with his wrister using a wood stick, Bret Hull it took some forearm man strength for sure. Weber and Chara could sure murder them pucks too. Webers sometimes broke mesh - once went through the end boards through the net in practice. Edited May 2, 2023 by IBatch 1 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alflives Posted May 2, 2023 Share Posted May 2, 2023 3 minutes ago, IBatch said: You bet... Al Mac and Al Ifrate, Wilson ... could murder that puck with wood...Some guys like Al Mac never changed into the hybrids which had more flex ... Wendel Clark breaking masks with his wrister using a wood stick, Bret Hull it took some forearm man strength for sure. Weber and Chara could sure murder them pucks too. Webers sometimes broke mesh - once went through the end boards through the net in practice. It was rare to see a great wrist shot with a wooden stick. Lanny was one who could fire a wrister. But mostly there was some take back to get enough force into the ice to flex the stick, so it took time. Now these sticks are way too forgiving. The league should have stayed with wood like baseball did with the bat. 2 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fred65 Posted May 2, 2023 Share Posted May 2, 2023 I recall an interview with Brett Hull and he was asked if he used a 100 or 110 flex stick ( which was pretty common in those days ) and Brett laughed and said heck no I use a 65 It was a time when i was trying to have my children look at a lower flex. Often D'men used a 100 flex at that time ( slap shots and cross checking LOL ) Times have chnaged ad the speed of the game makes it less likely to take a slap shot today, you simply rarely get the time 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Miss Korea Bob.Loblaw Posted May 2, 2023 Share Posted May 2, 2023 20 hours ago, N7Nucks said: If he's a runner up playing on a team with the 9th worst GA in the league and the league worst PK. I dunno man. Seems like fan service to suggest he even belongs in the convo. I get it's a team game, but if you are the 2nd best defensive forward in the league, it should have some effect on team success. 20 hours ago, Kevin Biestra said: I would say it probably did have an effect on team success. He prevented the team from being much much worse. Players are already disqualified from the Hart Trophy if their team doesn't make the playoffs and I've been against that for years...but I think the DQs should stop there. Pettersson led the league in shorthanded goals and somehow was a +16 on a team with a -22 goal differential. Honestly it is quite impressive that he and Hughes managed a +16 and a +15 under their circumstances. Pettersson's metrics absolutely show that his defensive contributions helped the team in a big way. It's just that there are other players with better metrics. Yes, part of the reason for that is because they played for better teams. Bergeron wouldn't win Selke trophies if he played for Arizona, but that's just life. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Westcoasting Posted May 2, 2023 Share Posted May 2, 2023 5 hours ago, Alflives said: It was rare to see a great wrist shot with a wooden stick. Lanny was one who could fire a wrister. But mostly there was some take back to get enough force into the ice to flex the stick, so it took time. Now these sticks are way too forgiving. The league should have stayed with wood like baseball did with the bat. Now it’s a crazy world out there, bought a Bauer Nexus with the Joe Sakic curve on it off a friend of mine cheap… I might be senile but I’m pretty sure I can shoot a puck better now at 62 than I ever could before! 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
greenbean30 Posted May 3, 2023 Share Posted May 3, 2023 Well he's not a finalist, disappointing but the right call. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Arrogant Worms Posted May 3, 2023 Share Posted May 3, 2023 Marner is a joke. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EddieVedder Posted May 3, 2023 Share Posted May 3, 2023 30 minutes ago, The Arrogant Worms said: Marner is a joke. Why? I hate the leafs but Hes clearly one of the best 2 way forwards on the planet. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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