Tyndall2 Posted March 20, 2019 Share Posted March 20, 2019 On 3/19/2019 at 1:21 PM, aGENT said: aGent---love your response. Don't we all wish we had a crystal ball. LOL 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aGENT Posted March 20, 2019 Share Posted March 20, 2019 6 hours ago, 73 Percent said: Some of us have been preaching this for the majority of the season. Tanev too. These players provide zero offence and are no better than goldy. If goldobin cant play in only one zone how do these 2 get away with it. Come on 73.... You need players to play things like PK, Dzone starts etc. They're a lot better in 'their' one zone than Goldy is in 'his'. No, they don't create much offense (though Sutter's on pace for his standard +/-35 points per 82 as always) but they also don't cost the team as many goals against either. Thus far, Goldy has not been remotely close to outscoring his defensive shortcomings. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
73 Percent Posted March 21, 2019 Share Posted March 21, 2019 (edited) 31 minutes ago, aGENT said: Come on 73.... You need players to play things like PK, Dzone starts etc. They're a lot better in 'their' one zone than Goldy is in 'his'. No, they don't create much offense (though Sutter's on pace for his standard +/-35 points per 82 as always) but they also don't cost the team as many goals against either. Thus far, Goldy has not been remotely close to outscoring his defensive shortcomings. I meant more towards the effort side of things. Stats aside goldy only makes an attempt in 1 zone. As does sutter and tanev. Tanev and sutter are obviously hands down betternat their one zone play and are more valuable players in general. However, if im building a team, this style of play doesn't pass (especially for vets). Contribution in all 3 zones are key. Side note I've really enjoyed your reading posts and discussions lately. Edited March 21, 2019 by 73 Percent 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aGENT Posted March 21, 2019 Share Posted March 21, 2019 2 minutes ago, 73 Percent said: I meant more towards the effort side of things. Stats aside goldy only makes an attempt in 1 zone. As does sutter and tanev. Tanev and sutter are obviously hands down betternat their one zone play and are more valuable players in general. However, if im building a team, this style of play doesn't pass (especially for vets). Contribution in all 3 zones are key. Not sure I entirely agree with that but fair enough. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dpn1 Posted March 21, 2019 Share Posted March 21, 2019 Hey, Shotgun 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dpn1 Posted March 21, 2019 Share Posted March 21, 2019 (edited) On 9/7/2018 at 3:35 PM, -AJ- said: Personally, I'm keeping my expectations modest for Virtanen. I'd be happy if he gets 30 points. I could see him approaching 40, but even 30 would be a good step forward for him. There were a few people that said 15 to 20 goals 30 to 40 points would be a good next step for him in his development. He is hitting that now even though he was injured and out of the lineup for 3 1/2 weeks. Everyone experiences droughts during the year. Even our top 3 guys this year did. It seems like some can't just let go off the Jake bashing. Jake was drafted where he was by the management and they should bare the ire of CDB not Jake. There are no guarantees in drafting. At the age of being drafted, these are kids being picked for their potential. Every team has their hits and misses. Jake taken a little too soon and BB6 ant EP40 should have been taken sooner. Be realistic about the Draft and Jake for a change fellow CDB brothers. Edited March 21, 2019 by dpn1 2 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
5Fivehole0 Posted March 21, 2019 Share Posted March 21, 2019 3 hours ago, dpn1 said: There were a few people that said 15 to 20 goals 30 to 40 points would be a good next step for him in his development. He is hitting that now even though he was injured and out of the lineup for 3 1/2 weeks. Everyone experiences droughts during the year. Even our top 3 guys this year did. It seems like some can't just let go off the Jake bashing. Jake was drafted where he was by the management and they should bare the ire of CDB not Jake. There are no guarantees in drafting. At the age of being drafted, these are kids being picked for their potential. Every team has their hits and misses. Jake taken a little too soon and BB6 ant EP40 should have been taken sooner. Be realistic about the Draft and Jake for a change fellow CDB brothers. Jake shows flashes of why he was drafted high. When you see his elite shot(power not accuracy), and skating, it shows why he was drafted so high. On a top end team, he would be brewing nicely in the AHL. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rob_Zepp Posted March 21, 2019 Share Posted March 21, 2019 5 hours ago, dpn1 said: There were a few people that said 15 to 20 goals 30 to 40 points would be a good next step for him in his development. He is hitting that now even though he was injured and out of the lineup for 3 1/2 weeks. Everyone experiences droughts during the year. Even our top 3 guys this year did. It seems like some can't just let go off the Jake bashing. Jake was drafted where he was by the management and they should bare the ire of CDB not Jake. There are no guarantees in drafting. At the age of being drafted, these are kids being picked for their potential. Every team has their hits and misses. Jake taken a little too soon and BB6 ant EP40 should have been taken sooner. Be realistic about the Draft and Jake for a change fellow CDB brothers. For whatever it is worth, Canuck's record this season with Virtanen in the lineup and playing more than 12 minutes is playoff bound. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
canuckistani Posted March 21, 2019 Share Posted March 21, 2019 Virtanen is coming along okay. Right now, he needs the right set-up for him, to take the next steps. Yes, we can all say 'whats wrong with him, why are we accomodating him so much, blahblah' but it is what it is. Player development is 50% player responsibility and 50% team. We know Jake isn't the sharpest tool in the kit, so lets help him. What he needs, is to be put in a 'low expectations' line. By that, i mean he isn't in a line who's primary job is to PK against the best of the best ( like with Sutter line) or on a line who's job is to drive some offence, shut down and be the swiss army knife line ( Bo line). What he needs, is to be on a line with someone like Gaudette - an allrounder, who can do everything decently, yet the expectation isn't to kill penalties, shut down the top line or be productive every night. This lifts the burden of expectations on him, as well as giving him a centerman to play with, who is multi-faceted. Gaudette, unlike Sutter, is not a black hole of puck death. Sutter only ever gets garbage goals these days or a simple 'skate by snapshot' that the goalies should've had. Otherwise, you give him the puck = weak shot and turn over posession or he jams it up in his skates along the boards to kill some more time. The puck is not coming back at you. This damages confidence and development. Virtanen, in a developmental team like ours, belongs in a line that looks somewhat like Roussell - Gaudette- Virtanen. A line that can hold its own, but also has a guy who can feed him the puck, take some pressure off etc. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tre Mac Posted March 21, 2019 Share Posted March 21, 2019 That moment when Jake scores and you're drinking water in a glass Haha I kid, I'll never ever have a beer, fools! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kanucks25 Posted March 22, 2019 Share Posted March 22, 2019 On 3/20/2019 at 4:47 PM, aGENT said: though Sutter's on pace for his standard +/-35 points per 82 as always I would absolutely love to see the math behind this one. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Borvat Posted March 22, 2019 Share Posted March 22, 2019 (edited) 33 minutes ago, kanucks25 said: I would absolutely love to see the math behind this one. His pace was actually 19 points this season (6/26=0.23 ppg x 82) but he was playing injured for a part of it. Problem is he is usually injured. 188 games played out of 328 with the Canucks. He has only reached 35 or more once in 11 seasons, but has been over 30 in 2 of the past 5 years. Edited March 22, 2019 by Borvat Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
canuck_in_england Posted March 22, 2019 Share Posted March 22, 2019 I only really see the highlights and obviously the stats but I read about the frustration about Jake so I would like to know what we want from him next year. Is it not necessarily about a step up in points but rather consistency and being a 'presence' on the ice in all shifts? I guess for some fans next year is make or break or are most fans understanding that this is the progression of a power foward and it will take longer than that? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lmm Posted March 22, 2019 Share Posted March 22, 2019 11 minutes ago, canuck_in_england said: I only really see the highlights and obviously the stats but I read about the frustration about Jake so I would like to know what we want from him next year. Is it not necessarily about a step up in points but rather consistency and being a 'presence' on the ice in all shifts? I guess for some fans next year is make or break or are most fans understanding that this is the progression of a power foward and it will take longer than that? what we want is Cam Neeley, what we see is Shawn Mathias 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dpn1 Posted March 22, 2019 Share Posted March 22, 2019 14 minutes ago, lmm said: what we want is Cam Neeley, what we see is Shawn Mathias Come on, Shawn Mathias wouldn't hit anyone and wasn't that fast. I wouldn't use him as a comparison and its crazy to think he was the reincarnation of Cam Neeley. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aGENT Posted March 22, 2019 Share Posted March 22, 2019 14 hours ago, kanucks25 said: I would absolutely love to see the math behind this one. Sorry, was before his recent stint when he came back and clearly still wasn't 100% (and wasn't particularly playing well). He was on his normal +/-35 per 82 pace before that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TGT68 Posted March 24, 2019 Share Posted March 24, 2019 (edited) But back to Jake for a minute. What was that fly by he did on Giordano right before the third goal? What do we need to do with this kid to make him want to hit and want the damn puck? I love Jake, the potential he brings, the speed, the skill. When he is on he is my favourite Canuck. But wholly crap.....I saw him approach Giordano wondered if he would follow through with the hit or stand him up and fight for the puck. I was so blown away by the flyby I had to watch the replay for the goal. What da......? Hit the guy! Edited March 24, 2019 by TGT68 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dannydog Posted March 25, 2019 Share Posted March 25, 2019 8 hours ago, TGT68 said: But back to Jake for a minute. What was that fly by he did on Giordano right before the third goal? What do we need to do with this kid to make him want to hit and want the damn puck? I love Jake, the potential he brings, the speed, the skill. When he is on he is my favourite Canuck. But wholly crap.....I saw him approach Giordano wondered if he would follow through with the hit or stand him up and fight for the puck. I was so blown away by the flyby I had to watch the replay for the goal. What da......? Hit the guy! I believe he is afraid.He really only starts pushing/pulling ,lite jabs or a face wash when the linesmen and refs are in between.You can see it in his expression just when a conflict starts. His natural born hockey gifts of speed, size, a really good shot and when he does deliver that hit, its bone crushing. His natural talents if he chooses to use them consistently(which he should) is always gonna attract physical attention in a retalitory way. Teach the kid to fight,build his confidence. Train him with fighters of his build on how to control opponents,pick his spots ect..I'm not saying "make jake an enforcer" but teach him these tools. All Confidence based. You can see the difference in a secure man compared to an insecure one. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zhukini Posted March 25, 2019 Share Posted March 25, 2019 Hansen comparisions look generous right now 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ballisticsports. Posted March 25, 2019 Share Posted March 25, 2019 On 3/24/2019 at 9:51 AM, TGT68 said: But back to Jake for a minute. What was that fly by he did on Giordano right before the third goal? What do we need to do with this kid to make him want to hit and want the damn puck? I love Jake, the potential he brings, the speed, the skill. When he is on he is my favourite Canuck. But wholly crap.....I saw him approach Giordano wondered if he would follow through with the hit or stand him up and fight for the puck. I was so blown away by the flyby I had to watch the replay for the goal. What da......? Hit the guy! It's no secret he does not put the effort in to improve like EP or Bo He does not look to be interested in putting in the extra effort to be better Like on the play you mention , he does not look to want any opportunity to be potential hurting, whether it's blocking a shot or getting in someone's face He looks like a younger kid quite content to skate around the outside, taking low percentage shots from out wide that miss the net and run play the other way and earn a very good wage Maybe just before his contract is about to expire and he matures a bit, he will try harder for his next contract an impress and have a breakout season It is my opinion if he does that , that then is when we trade him (If a good return is presented). He is not motivated enough to be better it appears he does not have the drive as the above players or any Tzachuk (even younger ones) that is when we trade him- Trade high for once in the Canucks history on a player, rather than always buying high with guys having a career year and never attaining that again 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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