Alflives Posted January 16, 2016 Share Posted January 16, 2016 2 minutes ago, stawns said: He's not going get seasoning in Jr. He's going to get bored and lazy And fat. The kids don't follow great diets in junior. The teams save money by feeding the boys at cheaper all you can eat places. He was over weight when he came to the Comets last spring. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Down by the River Posted January 16, 2016 Share Posted January 16, 2016 (edited) 30 minutes ago, Alflives said: And fat. The kids don't follow great diets in junior. The teams save money by feeding the boys at cheaper all you can eat places. He was over weight when he came to the Comets last spring. Burr was on 1040 and asked about the WJHC. He said Jake would benefit from coming back to the team and losing weight. Not even subtle about it. Less time on the bus in the WHL and more time in the gym in the NHL. No more breakfast buffets at the Best Western. Edited January 16, 2016 by Down by the River 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Crabcakes Posted January 16, 2016 Share Posted January 16, 2016 7 hours ago, N4ZZY said: I think some seasoning may not be a bad thing for Jake. if he comes into camp next season right where he is currently. then yeah. maybe he needs to get some more time developing and playing in the AHL. I don't think that would be a bad thing and Green would help him develop both sides of his game. the offensive and defensive side of the puck. that only bodes well for Jake. the only reason he's with the NHL club this season is because I don't think Benning thinks being in junior would help Jake with his game. I'm not convinced that Jake hits his maximum potential. but if he hits 55-60 points a season and 20 m-25 goals. I think that's a win. if he ever hits 30 goals. we got ourselves a gem! we can only hope right. his hockey IQ seems to be the thing in question by many "experts". I guess we will see what kind of player he will develop into. I feel for him sometimes. he carries a huge weight on him especially being a local kid. being selected sixth overall doesn't help either. I agree, there is every possibility that he spends time in Utica next year though. The point is, to be an NHL player, Jake will have to play a different sort of game than he was able to play in junior and going back to that isn't going to help his NHL game. He's not the only one who has had to retool his game a little to be effective in the NHL. Travis Green can help him to get his game NHL ready (as he is with many others). He was drafted for his size (physical game), speed and shot. They're not teaching that but they can teach him how to use these gifts more effectively. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
N4ZZY Posted January 16, 2016 Share Posted January 16, 2016 2 hours ago, stawns said: He's not going get seasoning in Jr. He's going to get bored and lazy seasoning in the AHL. I understand the reason for management to keep him up here in the NHL. but I'm saying that he might start the season if he doesn't come into camp ready. might start in the AHL. and I personally wouldn't mind that. might be good for him to just play his game in a top six role if we are wanting him to develop into a top six player for this team. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
N4ZZY Posted January 16, 2016 Share Posted January 16, 2016 22 minutes ago, Crabcakes said: I agree, there is every possibility that he spends time in Utica next year though. The point is, to be an NHL player, Jake will have to play a different sort of game than he was able to play in junior and going back to that isn't going to help his NHL game. He's not the only one who has had to retool his game a little to be effective in the NHL. Travis Green can help him to get his game NHL ready (as he is with many others). He was drafted for his size (physical game), speed and shot. They're not teaching that but they can teach him how to use these gifts more effectively. I agree. I think it wouldn't be a bad thing for him to spend some time down in the AHL. learn the or game. he's doing that in the NHL. but the NHL is about winning games. not developing players. so as much as Benning says otherwise. at the end of the day they are in the business of winning. while leagues like the AHL are a little bit more emphasis on development of young players. I hate the rule where players under the age of 20 can't be in the AHL. that really sucks. would love for both Jake and Jared to have been down in the AHL this year. don't know if they would learn much more down in junior to be honest. but it feels like at times they're overmatched either physically or just via the pro game. I hope they do well. whichever way management goes in terms of their development. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
N4ZZY Posted January 16, 2016 Share Posted January 16, 2016 1 hour ago, Down by the River said: Burr was on 1040 and asked about the WJHC. He said Jake would benefit from coming back to the team and losing weight. Not even subtle about it. Less time on the bus in the WHL and more time in the gym in the NHL. No more breakfast buffets at the Best Western. I didn't know junior clubs didn't have strict regiment for food and diet. that's really bad for the players no? glad that Jake is here then. a big part of being s pro is looking after your body and what your putting into your body. wow. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
canuckistani Posted January 16, 2016 Share Posted January 16, 2016 2 hours ago, WeneedLumme said: Absolutely. IMO anyone who thinks that Jake's game will develop better by spending more time bullying kids who are younger, smaller, weaker and less skilled than he is, embedding into his muscle memory moves that only work against children, has apparently never played any games, let alone any physical sports. And comparing hockey to engineering is ludicrous. When I studied engineering, there were thousands of hours of book learning and no physical component at all. And once you started, if it was difficult for you, going back to elementary school was't going to help you. I disagree, because we are projecting JV to be a potential 1st/2nd line right-winger. Had he been projected as a 3rd/4th line right-winger, it'd be perfectly fine letting him being in the NHL and learning on the fly. But the point is, his offensive game is NOT going to develop here, because he simply won't get the opportunity to hone those skills. All skills are 'use it or lose it' kind of skills. You cannot expect a player who gets zero PP time for 3-4 years to suddenly turn into a PP monster, or someone who never plays with finesse oriented centers (which is what all first line centers are- finesse oriented. Big or small, they all got finesse and skills) to suddenly play like he is anticipating a killer feed. If JV plays on in the NHL, he will end up being a third/fourth liner. Because his physical game is effective, coaches will focus more and more on his defensive zone positioning, his ability to hit will be harnessed into a sandpaper and abrasion role, which will mean he will eventually end up with a ceiling similar to Raffi Torres and not Milan Lucic. For JV to develop into a potential Milan Lucic, he needs to play top line minutes, top PP unit, etc. The only place he can play that, is in the juniors right now and IMO he needs more time developing as a 1st/2nd line offensively gifted power forward rather than a bone crunching power forward with limited offensive upside, which is what he is likely to become in the NHL without proper offensive minutes(which he won't get with the canucks). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Down by the River Posted January 16, 2016 Share Posted January 16, 2016 (edited) 1 hour ago, canuckistani said: I disagree, because we are projecting JV to be a potential 1st/2nd line right-winger. Had he been projected as a 3rd/4th line right-winger, it'd be perfectly fine letting him being in the NHL and learning on the fly. But the point is, his offensive game is NOT going to develop here, because he simply won't get the opportunity to hone those skills. All skills are 'use it or lose it' kind of skills. You cannot expect a player who gets zero PP time for 3-4 years to suddenly turn into a PP monster, or someone who never plays with finesse oriented centers (which is what all first line centers are- finesse oriented. Big or small, they all got finesse and skills) to suddenly play like he is anticipating a killer feed. This same argument was used to explain why Horvat needed to be sent back to London. I've seen no issue with Horvat's skill level. There is also no reason to believe that JV won't be playing PP minutes in 3-4 years. The Canucks also employ a skills coach for a reason. Edited January 16, 2016 by Down by the River Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
canuckistani Posted January 16, 2016 Share Posted January 16, 2016 2 hours ago, Down by the River said: This same argument was used to explain why Horvat needed to be sent back to London. I've seen no issue with Horvat's skill level. There is also no reason to believe that JV won't be playing PP minutes in 3-4 years. The Canucks also employ a skills coach for a reason. Horvat got utilized more than Virtanen- he averaged more than two minutes per game than Virtanen in his rookie season. Plus, Horvat to be fair, was projected to make an easier transition to the NHL, since he was seen as a player with good allround skills and hockey IQ. This has mostly borne out, where Horvat just needs to get a bit stronger and more experienced to be a 2C typer performer. Virtanen on the other hand, has a lot of raw power and decent shot, with a lower level of game-sense than Horvat had. This is obvious, from seeing Jake play. What he needs, is exposure in the type of scenarios that he is not getting in the NHL: ability to play alongside top end playmakers and ability to play important minutes- such as a power play with the clock winding down, etc. These are the abilities he is not able to hone here and in my humble opinion, he needs to do this, before we end up typecasting him as a speedy, muscular power forward with decent hands but not playing an offensive game. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gaudette Celly Posted January 16, 2016 Share Posted January 16, 2016 6 hours ago, stawns said: I'm honestly at a loss as to why anyone would be complaining about his, or mccaans game last night. Both Of them played fine.......no glaring errors that cost the team, both had chances in the o-zone. Not sure what more people want or expect. Seems to be this idea out there that young players should not be on the team unless they are able to walk on as a completed product and instantly perform and produce. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thejazz97 Posted January 16, 2016 Share Posted January 16, 2016 Will Jake Virtanen ever have more than his dirtstache? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CanucksJay Posted January 17, 2016 Share Posted January 17, 2016 I've noticed that Jake hasn't been hitting as much lately. I think he's making a conscious effort not to be overly aggressive and trying to stay in position. He's playing better without the puck and is more aggressive when he does have the puck. While I am happy with the latter, I used to really enjoy it when he used to take runs at players. I like that edge and want the opposing D to be looking over their shoulders when retrieving the puck (leading to mistakes and turnovers) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NameFaker Posted January 17, 2016 Share Posted January 17, 2016 10 hours ago, CanucksJay said: I've noticed that Jake hasn't been hitting as much lately. I think he's making a conscious effort not to be overly aggressive and trying to stay in position. He's playing better without the puck and is more aggressive when he does have the puck. While I am happy with the latter, I used to really enjoy it when he used to take runs at players. I like that edge and want the opposing D to be looking over their shoulders when retrieving the puck (leading to mistakes and turnovers) Yeah, I'm with you. I thought Jake, overall, made a more noticeable impact on games early on in the season. You noticed the same trends as me, though. He's been positionally sound and less aggressive. This isn't a bad thing, because it suggests he's growing into thinking through the game. He's also been effective by underlying metrics. More so as the season progresses. I have high hopes for this kid. He looks like a future 2nd liner, and I think with the Canucks actively investing in development, he's more likely to reach that ceiling than not. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CanucksJay Posted January 17, 2016 Share Posted January 17, 2016 1 minute ago, NameFaker said: Yeah, I'm with you. I thought Jake, overall, made a more noticeable impact on games early on in the season. You noticed the same trends as me, though. He's been positionally sound and less aggressive. This isn't a bad thing, because it suggests he's growing into thinking through the game. He's also been effective by underlying metrics. More so as the season progresses. I have high hopes for this kid. He looks like a future 2nd liner, and I think with the Canucks actively investing in development, he's more likely to reach that ceiling than not. Yes. I'm totally good with him trying to figure out the cerebral part of the game while putting the crash and bang style on hold. Once he gets it I would love it if he can pick his spots and lays out some guys. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Down by the River Posted January 20, 2016 Share Posted January 20, 2016 JV as a figure skater. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Boudrias Posted January 20, 2016 Share Posted January 20, 2016 1 hour ago, Down by the River said: JV as a figure skater. Some guys get all the job benefits! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aGENT Posted January 20, 2016 Share Posted January 20, 2016 Brunette ^^^^ = yummmmm 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CANUCK-EXPRESS Posted January 20, 2016 Share Posted January 20, 2016 2 hours ago, Down by the River said: JV as a figure skater. What a low IQ ehh??? Can't even figure skate Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Down by the River Posted January 20, 2016 Share Posted January 20, 2016 1 minute ago, CANUCK-EXPRESS said: What a low IQ ehh??? Can't even figure skate All he does is triple Salchow when Nylander is out there hitting axels, lutzs, Biellmans, Walleys, you name it. 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Odd. Posted January 20, 2016 Share Posted January 20, 2016 can we get to 1000 pages pls. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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