Canucks’ four biggest mistakes of the past year

[FireGillis]

Pretty bang on article that I mostly agree with.

[DeNiro]

So tired of analysts saying they're not choosing a direction.

They seem to think that a complete tear down can be done overnight. And that if you're not choosing one extreme side of the spectrum you're not doing anything.

They have been transitioning youth in where they can. The problem is the prospect cupboard was so bear when Benning got here it takes time to develop NHL ready players. In the meantime he's filling the holes left with players he thinks can lead by example for the young guys who have made it.

You don't just trade every vet and play a team full of rookies. That's not how it's done.

As far as the cap not being flexible, that's not true at all. Next summer the team could have over 16 million in cap space.

[aGENT]

I said much the same thing in the "bizarre" thread. Of course the Benning cheerleaders were quick to slam that opinion.

My point has always been that the Canucks have tried to turn Kassian into something he's not. A player like Brandon Prust, with a slightly better offensive upside.

In my mind, Kassian is a pure skill player, who will occasionally chip in in the toughness department but not make it his main focus. If the Habs allow him to play that game, I believe this trade will indeed look bad for the Canucks.

Kassian's problem was never how he played or how the Canucks supposedly wanted him to play (in your mind). It was playing ANY way consistently with a consistent effort so the coaches knew what they were going to get when they put him on the ice 9 times out of 10.

What 'style' that was was largely irrelevant.

Same thing I tried to explain all last year in Kassian threads, particularly when Vey was brought up. Kassian has all the tools to be a much better player than Vey but Vey got more minutes and opportunity. The main reason for this was Vey's consistent effort and consistent style. Even if Vey wasn't showing up on the score sheet, WD knew 9 times out of 10 what he'd get from him when he put him on the ice. Hence he knew who to match him up with (line mates and opposition) and what game situations he could trust him to play in and get a likely result. That's it.

You're making some grand drama out of something really quite simple.

[DeNiro]

As far as Miller over Lack. The results won't be known until we see how Markstrom plays over the next couple years.

If Markstrom never reaches a higher level than Lack, then yes it was a mistake.

If he becomes a legit starter here, then the right choice was made.

[Monteeun]

I said much the same thing in the "bizarre" thread. Of course the Benning cheerleaders were quick to slam that opinion.

My point has always been that the Canucks have tried to turn Kassian into something he's not. A player like Brandon Prust, with a slightly better offensive upside.

In my mind, Kassian is a pure skill player, who will occasionally chip in in the toughness department but not make it his main focus. If the Habs allow him to play that game, I believe this trade will indeed look bad for the Canucks.

On the surface, It might look bad on us but i like to think that our team needs some muscle. Kassian being a skill player might fit in Montreal better than in Vancouver.

[GreyHatnDart]

I said much the same thing in the "bizarre" thread. Of course the Benning cheerleaders were quick to slam that opinion.

My point has always been that the Canucks have tried to turn Kassian into something he's not. A player like Brandon Prust, with a slightly better offensive upside.

In my mind, Kassian is a pure skill player, who will occasionally chip in in the toughness department but not make it his main focus. If the Habs allow him to play that game, I believe this trade will indeed look bad for the Canucks.

From what I saw of that thread, myself included, it's not cheerleading. It's having a differing opinion on trades. We don't KNOW how said traded players are going to perform on their new teams. We have no idea if Sutter is going to up his game, or if Lack does well in Carolina, or if Kassian magically discovers consistency in Montreal.

We also don't know all that's happened behind closed doors in regards to Kassian. What we do know is Benning values character guys, and quite happily unloaded Kassian for what most agree (myself included to a degree) was less than his worth. Poor asset management? From what we know, perhaps. Or, perhaps Benning trusts what he hears from WD and H Sedin in regards to Kassian in the locker room. A bad attitude can bring team spirit down in a heart beat and can mightily effect the team.

In regards to the OP, I said earlier in this thread that I'm mind boggled how some don't understand the direction we're heading in. It couldn't be blatantly more obvious unless Benning spray painted it on the side of Rogers Arena.

Character players. Guys that leave it out on the ice and lead by example. Very important for showing our up and coming prospects and fellow veterans for that matter of what it takes to stick in the league. This is clearly valued above all else, and the other things Benning has said, for instance getting younger, are lower on his list. Okay, so we traded Prust for Kassian. Older on that one. We kept Miller and traded Lack. But we got character and leadership that way. We got younger by picking up Bartkowski and dropping Bieksa for one thing.

Overall our average age is getting younger unless someone can show me otherwise. We're faster, and grittier.

The best captain IMO to suit up for this team wasn't a skilled guy really. He was good, not great at everything. By far his biggest quality was his heart, and that is the direction this team is going.

[Gaudette Celly]

I'm in agreement with the selling low of Kassian..I too,have no problem with trading him,but given his age and pedigree,he could have been given been built into a better asset....Seems like Benning couldn't get Kassian out of the door fast enough (even by throwing in that 5th for good measure..was it personal..?).....If Kassian does decide to get his act together,this trade could look really bad for JB..IMO

What are you talking about? Benning tried to trade him for most of the season, and that's all he could get..

This garbage about Benning "throwing in extra" in trades is pure made-up conjecture, on par with "Benning should have got more for Lack." It has no basis in reality and is invented for the sole purpose of trying to justify one's opinion. Just more of the "I don't understand what's going on, what's the plan" mindset of ignorance.

[Honky Cat]

What are you talking about? Benning tried to trade him for most of the season, and that's all he could get..

This garbage about Benning "throwing in extra" in trades is pure made-up conjecture, on par with "Benning should have got more for Lack." It has no basis in reality and is invented for the sole purpose of trying to justify one's opinion. Just more of the "I don't understand what's going on, what's the plan" mindset of ignorance.

I'm not disagreeing with the fact that that's all that Benning could have gotten for ZK at the time...Then they should have kept him (he wasn't breaking the bank) and built him into a better asset...simple as that..Sorry if I sound ignorant,and a dude who's trying real hard to justify my opinion...jeeeeeeeezzzzz..!!

[Fanuck]

These know it all analysts think that teams exist in a vacuum without external pressures.

It's clear to anyone who follows team even casually that ownership has given management a specific mandate - that is to maintain playoff competitiveness, whilst building on the fly as the term goes.

Ownership has no interest whatsoever in a full rebuild.

Imo, management (JB/TL), are doing a darn good job trying to accomplish a near impossible task. But it's AQ'S team and as we all know, billionaires are used to getting their way so they expect Canucks brass to get'er done no matter how difficult a task it is.

If AQ wasn't pulling the strings behind the scenes (maneuvering for a future sale), I'm certain we'd have seen quite a different couple of off seasons from JB/TL, but that would have taken more effort to write an article about and would have taken more insight than this network has apparently.

[baumerman77]

I just don't understand how anyone could say anything bad about Benning and the Canucks.

[Alflives]

Pretty bang on article that I mostly agree with.

I have noticed your POV on other boards, and disagree. The Gillis era was awful bad at stocking the next wave of talent, and developing them. Benning is rebuilding, restocking, while keeping the team competitive. 101 points last season proves he's doing well. The article was written by a person who never played in the league, and it's insulting.

[JamesB]

You need to remember those numbers you're so high on using to evaluate players are only a tool in the evaluation. They are not based in real science. The collection of the data is open to debate, along with the interpretation too. Simply, Sutter is a big step up on Bonino. Bonino can't skate worth a damn, and he's soft - like a marshmellow. I did not like his play from the first time I saw him, regardless of what any Numbers might indicate.

I agree with you that "hockey analytics" is only part of the story and that it fails to capture some important things -- like the value of speed, toughness and intensity. Those things wear down the opposing team and lead to other guys on your team scoring even if they do not show up in your numbers. That is what gives us hope about guys like Sutter and Dorsett and Prust and Sbisa. The question is: does Benning have the trade-off right?

I agree that Sutter is probably an upgrade on Bonino -- he is bigger, faster, and more intense. And, although Bonino was good on the PK and decent at shutdown, Sutter is better and is better in the faceoff circle. But is Sutter enough better to justify his much higher cap hit and giving up a good prospect and draft position in addition to the basic trade.

I am not saying I know the answer. I am saying it is a legitimate question and I will interested to see how things go this year.

I do know I don't want to see the Canucks trade away any more draft picks.

[Alflives]

I agree with you that "hockey analytics" is only part of the story and that it fails to capture some important things -- like the value of speed, toughness and intensity. Those things wear down the opposing team and lead to other guys on your team scoring even if they do not show up in your numbers. That is what gives us hope about guys like Sutter and Dorsett and Prust and Sbisa. The question is: does Benning have the trade-off right?

I agree that Sutter is probably an upgrade on Bonino -- he is bigger, faster, and more intense. And, although Bonino was good on the PK and decent at shutdown, Sutter is better and is better in the faceoff circle. But is Sutter enough better to justify his much higher cap hit and giving up a good prospect and draft position in addition to the basic trade.

I am not saying I know the answer. I am saying it is a legitimate question and I will interested to see how things go this

I do know I don't want to see the Canucks trade away any more draft picks.

I agree 110% with no more trading away picks, especially in the second and third rounds. If anything, we should be collecting more picks. Sutter may get fewer points than Bonino, but IMHO he will contribute more to the team winning. I love Hank, but heard many people say Kesler actually contributed more to the team winning, because of his non measurable intangibles. From what I have heard from people who played the game, Sutter provides those intangibles.

[250Integra]

I disagree with the Miller over Lack. They made the right decision.

As for sutter... I'm still in shock. I've said my stance enough. I'll let it go.

Poor cap management I have to agree with. Jem beanung can't count. He needs to review elementary school math.

As for the plan... Who knows. They say playoffs and retool... Its a complete mistake.

They had to buy at the deadline last year and push for the cup. JB stood pat other than acquiring Sven.

This off season... Again... Mind boggling moves and show 0 direction.

The time is now. The sedins are generational talents whether you like it or not. You don't rebuild when they are still at the top of their game.

Regardless of all this - the canucks are in my blood and they have my complete support. Lord Henrik and Daniel can carry this team to another cup before its all said and done.

Except, we haven't won a cup?

[DeNiro]

101 points last season proves he's doing well. The article was written by a person who never played in the league, and it's insulting.

He really doesn't get enough credit for that.

He was forced to find a new coach, hire new management, rearrange the scouting positions, trade Kesler, and try and restock an empty prospect cupboard in his first year as GM. I would say he did pretty well.

Not only did we stay competitive after losing one of our best players, we manage to add solid prospects at every position.

[poetica]

The article pretty well said everything I've been saying about these decisions...

[puckdontlie]

Kassian's problem was never how he played or how the Canucks supposedly wanted him to play (in your mind). It was playing ANY way consistently with a consistent effort so the coaches knew what they were going to get when they put him on the ice 9 times out of 10.

What 'style' that was was largely irrelevant.

Same thing I tried to explain all last year in Kassian threads, particularly when Vey was brought up. Kassian has all the tools to be a much better player than Vey but Vey got more minutes and opportunity. The main reason for this was Vey's consistent effort and consistent style. Even if Vey wasn't showing up on the score sheet, WD knew 9 times out of 10 what he'd get from him when he put him on the ice. Hence he knew who to match him up with (line mates and opposition) and what game situations he could trust him to play in and get a likely result. That's it.

You're making some grand drama out of something really quite simple.

I was also told that "what if" wasn't a compelling argument for justifying trading Lack in the event he would be a liability on a long term deal, yet the reason for keeping Kassian seems to be the same... "what if he unleashes his skill then the Canucks will regret the trade". To me, hanging onto a player without a purpose is not a compelling argument.

I totally agree with you J.R. that Kassian was inconsistent period... if he's not scoring, not hitting, not playing D then that roster spot can go to someone else who can do one or more of those things effectively and consistently. I say the same for Bonino... his game seems to be about putting his eggs in the basket of putting up points.. but if he's not scoring, not winning faceoffs, not hitting, not quick enough on D, then he has limited value. I totally agree that it doesn't necessarily matter what someone's game is.. if they have a one-dimensional specialty, they better be the pretty good at it esp if they don't play solid D or else they have limited value.

[Crabcakes]

The Oilers struggle because they have poor goaltending and defense. (Something that they've addressed, finally, this off-season) There is absolutely nothing wrong with the development of Hall, Nuge and Eberle and the jury's still out on Yak.

This thread is so predictable....

A few weeks ago, CBS Sports wrote an unflattering article about the Canucks and it was an instant flood of "CBS. What do they know about hockey?!". Now were seeing the same thing being said about Sportsnet. Next, I suppose it'll be NHL.com.

The points are perfectly valid. Disagree with them if you like, but the "What do they know?" argument is weak.

The Oilers have struggled for lots of reasons. Poor goaltending and defense is just one of them. For the Oilers, it starts with poor management. Kevin Lowe.....Craig MacTavish......Dallas Eakins......etc.

What we're talking about is their lack of a strong team culture which comes from their lack of veterans. Remember when Ryan Smith was the only vet, then it was Ference. Chirelli at least has the whit to add a few others. What I said above, their culture had been stripped away and they had to re-invent themselves. It takes forever. Isn't Taylor Hall's lack of back check effort amusing. Of how about how the team was boo-ed off the ice at home. At least Canuck management gets it and they're not going to strip it down like so many fools on CDC call for.

I don't know what some of these so called sports journalists spend their time doing but they obviously don't give a whole lot of thought to what they write and the reasons why Benning does what he does. They can't or won't get past one step logic and if a plan doesn't fit with their simplistic cookie cutter formulae, then it must be crap. What gets me is that so many readers just lap it all up as gospel truth. They think that if it's written in the paper, then it comes from an expert and we must bow down to his wisdom. Most of the time, these "experts" are just tossing off a bunch of drivel just to make a deadline.

[Crabcakes]

Kassian's problem was never how he played or how the Canucks supposedly wanted him to play (in your mind). It was playing ANY way consistently with a consistent effort so the coaches knew what they were going to get when they put him on the ice 9 times out of 10.

What 'style' that was was largely irrelevant.

Same thing I tried to explain all last year in Kassian threads, particularly when Vey was brought up. Kassian has all the tools to be a much better player than Vey but Vey got more minutes and opportunity. The main reason for this was Vey's consistent effort and consistent style. Even if Vey wasn't showing up on the score sheet, WD knew 9 times out of 10 what he'd get from him when he put him on the ice. Hence he knew who to match him up with (line mates and opposition) and what game situations he could trust him to play in and get a likely result. That's it.

You're making some grand drama out of something really quite simple.

Benning talked to Kassian personally and told him how he wanted him to play. Be more physical, use your size, skate in straight lines and go to the net. Kassian said all this to the press at the time and he did it for a couple of games. Then he reverted and sometimes played the way they wanted and sometimes he was all over the place. Not just from game to game but from shift to shift. He's like a little puppy dog out there. No discipline.

There's the skate the puck into the corner then try a cross ice pass to the opposite point which was my favorite. I think he connected once. This might work in junior.

So ya, maybe it WAS personal. He just isn't Benning material and if he got shipped out for a bag of pucks then so be it. He won't be missed anywhere but the Roxy.

[Pears]

Four big mistakes

Hiring benning

Keeping benning

Not bring up Shinckaruk

Drafting virtanen instead of Ritchie or Ehlers

One big mistake

You making this post.