alfstonker Posted January 8, 2016 Share Posted January 8, 2016 Agree with that. I keep coming back to thinking if Vey had been our own draft pick he would have been cut a lot more slack. I admit he did not have a good pre-season and probably deserved to go down to Utica. However since coming back up I think he has played better each game. No player on the team plays flawlessly, I saw two giveaways by the Sedins against the Canes that would have cost us goals but for Markstrom. I like Vey's hustle and if we can wait half a season for Sven and Bo to start putting up points why can't we do the same for Vey? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stormriders Posted January 8, 2016 Share Posted January 8, 2016 5 hours ago, Baggins said: Raymond was moved down lines, benched and a healthy scratch when he made the nhl. He didn't start off good defensively and certainly not on the pk. It's called development. So why would you expect Vey to be those things the moment he steps into the nhl? Try paying a little more attention. I saw Vey win board battles and also park himself in front of the net in the last game. Focus on negatives and it's all you'll ever see. Btw, Raymond had 21 points in 49 games his rookie season and in his first full season 23 points in 72 games. Writing players off quickly will result in missing out on some potential. Not every player needs to become a star. Raymond has played 538 NHL games over 9 seasons. That's a pretty successful career. All Vey needs is experience to become a decent two way regular. It might be you who needs to pay a little more attention. I began by saying 'I will concede that this years version of Vey is better than last', but lets not pretend because he won a board battle or was in front of the net that this is his game. He is clearly not strong in these areas, although again, I will concede he is better than last year. And I actually stated that these two areas, board work and going to the dirty areas is where they were the same, because these were also weaknesses of Raymond. But you miss my point, were I simply said Vey and Raymond are not alike, because Raymond was a very fast skater that could get back on the back check which enabled him to play better defensively. Vey will never have that speed [won't magically appear now at age 24]. And finally, if you remember Raymond so well as cited, then you also remember this board wanting him dropped lines, traded etc. because he was not seen, even with all his skills and speed, as a player that could play in the tougher NHL. I never said the Vey might still not make it given more time and experience, although I think it unlikely, but that was not what my response was about. At 24, Vey is not like Raymond, who had his best NHL season with 25 goals and we were all excited, but that didn't last. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
grumpworsley Posted January 8, 2016 Share Posted January 8, 2016 I would like to see Vey on the wing with Bo and Baer as Vrbata is likely to slot in for JH on the first line. He seems to be a little lost at centre sometimes. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mattrek Posted January 8, 2016 Author Share Posted January 8, 2016 8 hours ago, alfstonker said: Agree with that. I keep coming back to thinking if Vey had been our own draft pick he would have been cut a lot more slack. I admit he did not have a good pre-season and probably deserved to go down to Utica. However since coming back up I think he has played better each game. No player on the team plays flawlessly, I saw two giveaways by the Sedins against the Canes that would have cost us goals but for Markstrom. I like Vey's hustle and if we can wait half a season for Sven and Bo to start putting up points why can't we do the same for Vey? Maybe you've forgotten, but Vey has already had one full season in the NHL and he actually regressed over that season rather than improved. If players are improving and working hard I have no problem with giving them more time, but with Vey I see nothing has changed from last year and his effort and compete level are just not good enough for the NHL right now. We took a gamble and traded a 2nd rounder for him, but as of now it looks like a losing bet. Oh well, you win some and you lose some, but having Vey slotted in over Shinkaruk and Gaunce is just prolonging their development. Gaunce has already shown he's pretty much ready to make the jump and Shinkaruk deserves some time with the club with how well he's been playing with Utica. I'm not saying take them up for the whole season, but at least give them some time to learn the NHL. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Caknuckle Puck Posted January 8, 2016 Share Posted January 8, 2016 8 hours ago, alfstonker said: Agree with that. I keep coming back to thinking if Vey had been our own draft pick he would have been cut a lot more slack. I admit he did not have a good pre-season and probably deserved to go down to Utica. However since coming back up I think he has played better each game. No player on the team plays flawlessly, I saw two giveaways by the Sedins against the Canes that would have cost us goals but for Markstrom. I like Vey's hustle and if we can wait half a season for Sven and Bo to start putting up points why can't we do the same for Vey? because that would be crazy, I dont think our "fans" could do that Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oldnews Posted January 8, 2016 Share Posted January 8, 2016 On 1/7/2016 at 11:01 PM, Wild Sean Monahan said: At some point, their draft position doesn't mean anything anymore. Ondrej Palat was a 7th round pick and we wouldn't be able to land him for a 2nd, as an example. Vey has developed beyond what most 4th rounders do and was probably worth a late 2nd/early 3rd (which is what he yielded). In hindsight maybe it hasn't worked but it was a logical gamble at the time. Yes, and at the time is when trades are judged - the only time they're judged fairly. Anyone can hindsight and pretend to know better years later. If they didn't take a position at the time, wadr, their opinion is worthless imo. Keeping things in context - a GM has the opportunities that exist at the time to work with. Used Garrison to generate cap space - signed Vrbata (and Miller) and used the pick to bring in a young, cheap contract that was producing very well at a young age at the AHL level. Had a replacement for Garrison via the Kesler deal. The Vey deal made solid sense at the time. People might question the decision not to re-sign Santo - a fair question - but like the Richardson context, Santo wanted more term than the Canucks were comfortable with and then was forced to accept a one year deal elsewhere. I wanted to re-sign Santo at the time - but we don't always get what we want. I probably like the Baertschi deal more - but again, that was another time, in another context, one that JB had no idea would become available. Some folks question why they'd spend both those 2nds and then wind up waiving one of them..... Well, you don't pass on Baertschi simply because you've acquired Vey - you take advantage of the opportunity at the time. GMs can't afford to dwell on every perceived micro-loss like some of us on these boards. Risk, gain and loss are part of every single move they make. Vey isn't all that, but he has some solid skills, he works hard, and he plays a responsible game. Can he get stronger and add some foot speed? Maybe. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alfstonker Posted January 8, 2016 Share Posted January 8, 2016 2 hours ago, Mattrek said: Maybe you've forgotten, but Vey has already had one full season in the NHL and he actually regressed over that season rather than improved. If players are improving and working hard I have no problem with giving them more time, but with Vey I see nothing has changed from last year and his effort and compete level are just not good enough for the NHL right now. We took a gamble and traded a 2nd rounder for him, but as of now it looks like a losing bet. Oh well, you win some and you lose some, but having Vey slotted in over Shinkaruk and Gaunce is just prolonging their development. Gaunce has already shown he's pretty much ready to make the jump and Shinkaruk deserves some time with the club with how well he's been playing with Utica. I'm not saying take them up for the whole season, but at least give them some time to learn the NHL. I take it from that you only gauge a player's success by how others on here rate him. That's a dangerous habit. Vey had a second half of his season like Vey and Bo had a first half this season. They are still in the team. How is he regressing when most people agree he has played pretty well this season? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Canucks-12 Posted January 9, 2016 Share Posted January 9, 2016 Forwards # NAME POS HEIGHT WEIGHT DATE OF BIRTH AGE BIRTH PLACE 47 SVEN BAERTSCHI L 5' 11" 190 5 OCT 1992 23 BERN, CHE 14 ALEXANDRE BURROWS R 6' 1" 188 11 APR 1981 34 PINCOURT, QC, CAN 24 ADAM CRACKNELL R 6' 2" 210 15 JUL 1985 30 PRINCE ALBERT, SK, CAN 15 DEREK DORSETT R 6' 0" 192 20 DEC 1986 29 KINDERSLEY, SK, CAN 26 EMERSON ETEM R 6' 1" 212 16 JUN 1992 23 LONG BEACH, CA, USA 50 BRENDAN GAUNCE C 6' 2" 207 25 MAR 1994 21 SUDBURY, ON, CAN 36 JANNIK HANSEN ** R 6' 1" 195 15 MAR 1986 29 RØDOVRE, DNK 20 CHRIS HIGGINS L 6' 0" 205 2 JUN 1983 32 SMITHTOWN, NY, USA 53 BO HORVAT C 6' 0" 206 5 APR 1995 20 LONDON, ON, CAN 91 JARED MCCANN C 6' 0" 179 31 MAY 1996 19 STRATFORD, ON, CAN 9 BRANDON PRUST L 6' 0" 195 16 MAR 1984 31 LONDON, ON, CAN 22 DANIEL SEDIN "A" L 6' 1" 187 26 SEP 1980 35 ORNSKOLDSVIK, SWE 33 HENRIK SEDIN "C" C 6' 2" 188 26 SEP 1980 35 ORNSKOLDSVIK, SWE 21 BRANDON SUTTER ** C 6' 3" 190 14 FEB 1989 26 HUNTINGTON, NY, USA 18 JAKE VIRTANEN R 6' 1" 208 17 AUG 1996 19 NEW WESTMINSTER, BC, CAN 17 RADIM VRBATA R 6' 1" 194 13 JUN 1981 34 MLADA BOLESLAV, CZE He's not on the team roster anymore Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alflives Posted January 9, 2016 Share Posted January 9, 2016 1 minute ago, Canucks-12 said: Forwards # NAME POS HEIGHT WEIGHT DATE OF BIRTH AGE BIRTH PLACE 47 SVEN BAERTSCHI L 5' 11" 190 5 OCT 1992 23 BERN, CHE 14 ALEXANDRE BURROWS R 6' 1" 188 11 APR 1981 34 PINCOURT, QC, CAN 24 ADAM CRACKNELL R 6' 2" 210 15 JUL 1985 30 PRINCE ALBERT, SK, CAN 15 DEREK DORSETT R 6' 0" 192 20 DEC 1986 29 KINDERSLEY, SK, CAN 26 EMERSON ETEM R 6' 1" 212 16 JUN 1992 23 LONG BEACH, CA, USA 50 BRENDAN GAUNCE C 6' 2" 207 25 MAR 1994 21 SUDBURY, ON, CAN 36 JANNIK HANSEN ** R 6' 1" 195 15 MAR 1986 29 RØDOVRE, DNK 20 CHRIS HIGGINS L 6' 0" 205 2 JUN 1983 32 SMITHTOWN, NY, USA 53 BO HORVAT C 6' 0" 206 5 APR 1995 20 LONDON, ON, CAN 91 JARED MCCANN C 6' 0" 179 31 MAY 1996 19 STRATFORD, ON, CAN 9 BRANDON PRUST L 6' 0" 195 16 MAR 1984 31 LONDON, ON, CAN 22 DANIEL SEDIN "A" L 6' 1" 187 26 SEP 1980 35 ORNSKOLDSVIK, SWE 33 HENRIK SEDIN "C" C 6' 2" 188 26 SEP 1980 35 ORNSKOLDSVIK, SWE 21 BRANDON SUTTER ** C 6' 3" 190 14 FEB 1989 26 HUNTINGTON, NY, USA 18 JAKE VIRTANEN R 6' 1" 208 17 AUG 1996 19 NEW WESTMINSTER, BC, CAN 17 RADIM VRBATA R 6' 1" 194 13 JUN 1981 34 MLADA BOLESLAV, CZE He's not on the team roster anymore Who cares about that. Jared McCann is from the same hometown as the Beibster! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fred65 Posted January 9, 2016 Share Posted January 9, 2016 He was appreciated when we needed a centre and now with Sutter on the brink of returning it's back to hey who is that bum. Fickle fans and shallow fore thought Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aqua59 Posted January 9, 2016 Share Posted January 9, 2016 WD is addicted to Vey. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JamesB Posted January 9, 2016 Share Posted January 9, 2016 2 hours ago, Fred65 said: He was appreciated when we needed a centre and now with Sutter on the brink of returning it's back to hey who is that bum. Fickle fans and shallow fore thought Vey has done a decent job in his current call-up. Is there any confirmation he has been sent down? For some reason I am never highly confident that the roster on the Canuck CDC website is up to date. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Freaky Freak Posted January 9, 2016 Share Posted January 9, 2016 4 hours ago, Canucks-12 said: Forwards # NAME POS HEIGHT WEIGHT DATE OF BIRTH AGE BIRTH PLACE 47 SVEN BAERTSCHI L 5' 11" 190 5 OCT 1992 23 BERN, CHE 14 ALEXANDRE BURROWS R 6' 1" 188 11 APR 1981 34 PINCOURT, QC, CAN 24 ADAM CRACKNELL R 6' 2" 210 15 JUL 1985 30 PRINCE ALBERT, SK, CAN 15 DEREK DORSETT R 6' 0" 192 20 DEC 1986 29 KINDERSLEY, SK, CAN 26 EMERSON ETEM R 6' 1" 212 16 JUN 1992 23 LONG BEACH, CA, USA 50 BRENDAN GAUNCE C 6' 2" 207 25 MAR 1994 21 SUDBURY, ON, CAN 36 JANNIK HANSEN ** R 6' 1" 195 15 MAR 1986 29 RØDOVRE, DNK 20 CHRIS HIGGINS L 6' 0" 205 2 JUN 1983 32 SMITHTOWN, NY, USA 53 BO HORVAT C 6' 0" 206 5 APR 1995 20 LONDON, ON, CAN 91 JARED MCCANN C 6' 0" 179 31 MAY 1996 19 STRATFORD, ON, CAN 9 BRANDON PRUST L 6' 0" 195 16 MAR 1984 31 LONDON, ON, CAN 22 DANIEL SEDIN "A" L 6' 1" 187 26 SEP 1980 35 ORNSKOLDSVIK, SWE 33 HENRIK SEDIN "C" C 6' 2" 188 26 SEP 1980 35 ORNSKOLDSVIK, SWE 21 BRANDON SUTTER ** C 6' 3" 190 14 FEB 1989 26 HUNTINGTON, NY, USA 18 JAKE VIRTANEN R 6' 1" 208 17 AUG 1996 19 NEW WESTMINSTER, BC, CAN 17 RADIM VRBATA R 6' 1" 194 13 JUN 1981 34 MLADA BOLESLAV, CZE He's not on the team roster anymore Benning said that Hansen went on IR with Sutter to fit Etem in And if Vey gets sent back he again has to clear waivers I believe ??? (can anyone confirm this ? ) And I also have not seen a call up for Gaunce ??? (or has anyone seen a news release on this ? ) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cowardrobertford Posted January 9, 2016 Share Posted January 9, 2016 Some troll on the nucks website, or an anti- vey Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mll Posted January 9, 2016 Share Posted January 9, 2016 nvm. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mll Posted January 9, 2016 Share Posted January 9, 2016 6 hours ago, Freaky Freak said: Benning said that Hansen went on IR with Sutter to fit Etem in And if Vey gets sent back he again has to clear waivers I believe ??? (can anyone confirm this ? ) And I also have not seen a call up for Gaunce ??? (or has anyone seen a news release on this ? ) 10 games or 30 days on the roster before having to clear waivers. Vey is at game 7. Gaunce was not called up - they forgot to remove him since his call-up at the start of the season. They also never added Vey. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shift-4 Posted January 9, 2016 Share Posted January 9, 2016 On 1/8/2016 at 5:37 AM, alfstonker said: Agree with that. I keep coming back to thinking if Vey had been our own draft pick he would have been cut a lot more slack. I admit he did not have a good pre-season and probably deserved to go down to Utica. However since coming back up I think he has played better each game. No player on the team plays flawlessly, I saw two giveaways by the Sedins against the Canes that would have cost us goals but for Markstrom. I like Vey's hustle and if we can wait half a season for Sven and Bo to start putting up points why can't we do the same for Vey? I was totally on board with your assessment until I got to the bolded part. I don't mean to attack just you, alfstonker but I see this argument all the time. Are we now comparing Vey to the Sedins? C'mon, man. Of course the twins get a pass when they make mistakes. They have won the Art Ross along with other major trophies. They have led the team in scoring for about the past decade. They will be hall of famers. Pointing out their mistakes to defend a fringe NHLer is nonsense. I have seen the same thing when people defend Edler. Well Keith and Doughty make mistakes too. I somewhat agree with your last line. I would look at it slightly differently - I think Vey's decent play tells us maybe McCann can finish the year in junior. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Junkyard Dog Posted January 9, 2016 Share Posted January 9, 2016 Vey will be sent down after his 10 games or he will become waiver eligible. He still hasn't played better than McCann and when people start coming back from injuries there will be no room for him. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alfstonker Posted January 9, 2016 Share Posted January 9, 2016 30 minutes ago, Shift-4 said: I was totally on board with your assessment until I got to the bolded part. I don't mean to attack just you, alfstonker but I see this argument all the time. Are we now comparing Vey to the Sedins? C'mon, man. Of course the twins get a pass when they make mistakes. They have won the Art Ross along with other major trophies. They have led the team in scoring for about the past decade. They will be hall of famers. Pointing out their mistakes to defend a fringe NHLer is nonsense. I have seen the same thing when people defend Edler. Well Keith and Doughty make mistakes too. I somewhat agree with your last line. I would look at it slightly differently - I think Vey's decent play tells us maybe McCann can finish the year in junior. No I wasn't that would be silly. What I'm trying to say is, in the same way we let mistakes go by talented players or indeed our favourites, we should be more forgiving of players who hustle and compete but may not be as talented. In other words let's judge players on their role in the team and if we did that we would see that Vey is playing pretty well. He is totally unselfish and therefore he is good for any line he is on, his effort allows others to use their flair and I think (when he is performing) that is what Willie values in his game. Our fans are unfair and unreasonable at times, the only difference between a Vey giveaway and a Henrik one is the outcome, nothing more or less. As to your last para, I would be sad if McCann left now, purely because the boy has such a will to win and compete. You could be right though and I'm happy either way if it is the right thing for the player. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alfstonker Posted January 9, 2016 Share Posted January 9, 2016 2 minutes ago, Junkyard Dog said: Vey will be sent down after his 10 games or he will become waiver eligible. He still hasn't played better than McCann and when people start coming back from injuries there will be no room for him. In that context you are probably right, although as Shift-4 says, the management may think that back to the Juniors is going to be more beneficial for Jared. The good thing to come out of this difficult season is at least we know McCann "has what it takes" as far as attitude, compete and will to win. Now we need to see if players like Gaunce, Grenier and Shink also have it. I think they do but it still has to happen or we will never know for certain. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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