Rollieo Del Fuego Posted July 16, 2015 Share Posted July 16, 2015 They seemed to really jump start the slap pass as well. Also icing the puck and letting the other skate onto it. Even the drop pass on the power play, although that was Newell Browns idea I believe. Amazing players them twin, unfortunate they'll never get the league wide respect they honestly deserve. At least from the fan bases. They have at least 2 more years and several players coming up that could make them better and us win the cup...instant recognition on the largest scale. This is the Grenier thread and he could be the one that clicks with them and creates magic while Horvat and Cassels elevate our 2nd and 3rd lines. It could be Virtanen or McCann (on his off wing I suppose), or Boeser (in a year or so) or a suprise player that gets them...or rather keeps them over 80 points each and allows our other lines to score more by doing so. With so many options coming on the left wing in Shinkaruk, Baertschi and Gaunce plus the young D. coming... We may be in cup contention this year and win it next year... There is your NHL wide recognition for the Sedins. Book it.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
samurai Posted July 16, 2015 Share Posted July 16, 2015 Grenier is in a spot where he should be able to make the big club. He had an excellent season and his game is pretty balanced. He will get a very serious look this year. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CRAZY_4_NAZZY Posted July 16, 2015 Share Posted July 16, 2015 http://www.hockeybuzz.com/blog/Carol-Schram/Vancouver-Canucks-More-on-Waivers-Kesler-Signs-Higgins-Not-on-Block/194/69989 Davis says that Alex Grenier will be waiver eligible, because his first pro games were with the Chicago Wolves in 2012-13. That happened before he signed his first NHL contract with the Canucks on April 30, 2013. I didn't think those games would count, but there's another clause that could come into play here:"The first season in which a player plays his first professional game (NHL or AHL) constitutes the first year for calculating the number of years of waiver exemption that he has."I'm still fuzzy about whether or not the games with the Wolves would count since Grenier wasn't under an NHL contract at that time. Canucks Army also suggests here that Grenier would be subject to waivers, so let's assume for the moment that this is correct. Not sure how credible and it is from hockey buzz, but just thought I post this to see what people thought. If this holds any grounds and is true, you can be sure Grenier will have a spot opening night. Not a chance he will slip through waivers untouched. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Canuck Surfer Posted July 16, 2015 Share Posted July 16, 2015 Agreed. I actually think Grenier AND Gaunce have a better chance than Virtanen. I know Virtanen hits like a train but you need more to stick in the NHL. Both Grenier and Gaunce are becoming well rounded high IQ thoughtful players who seem to me to have the grounding to stick if given a chance. I know Gaunce has been played down by JB but honestly both of these players seem to me to be more Willie's type of player and that may count for something. If Grenier is waiver eligible... Its no wonder Kassian, already out of favour, was traded. It makes it his job first. But I'm so excited to see Jake at the NHL level. I'm happy to wait if he's not ready. But that athleticism, speed and power is so compelling. He'll be given the next shot IMO. But they still have to win the job! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aGENT Posted July 16, 2015 Share Posted July 16, 2015 http://www.hockeybuzz.com/blog/Carol-Schram/Vancouver-Canucks-More-on-Waivers-Kesler-Signs-Higgins-Not-on-Block/194/69989 Not sure how credible and it is from hockey buzz, but just thought I post this to see what people thought. If this holds any grounds and is true, you can be sure Grenier will have a spot opening night. Not a chance he will slip through waivers untouched. That would be an interesting turn of events if true. Everything I've seen up to this point had him as able to go down, same as Jensen. Still need to make room for him somewhere though... Sedin, Sedin, Burrows Baer, Bonino, Vrbata Higgins, Horvat, Hansen Dorsett, Vey(?), Prust Grenier as spare? Maybe Prust plays 4C (he's played C occasionally) and it's Dorsett, Prust, Grenier with Vey as the spare? (I actually like the look of that.) Without an injury or trade that'll make it quite difficult for Virtanen to get his 9 games as well... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Psycho_Path Posted July 16, 2015 Share Posted July 16, 2015 I'm sure cycling was a thing well before the Sedins, but I don't believe the slap-pass was, at least not to a notable extent Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
elvis15 Posted July 16, 2015 Share Posted July 16, 2015 http://www.hockeybuzz.com/blog/Carol-Schram/Vancouver-Canucks-More-on-Waivers-Kesler-Signs-Higgins-Not-on-Block/194/69989 Not sure how credible and it is from hockey buzz, but just thought I post this to see what people thought. If this holds any grounds and is true, you can be sure Grenier will have a spot opening night. Not a chance he will slip through waivers untouched. But then if you go to the link in that same article that has the waivers covered in more detail, it says he's exempt. http://onecanuck.com/fun-with-the-cba-adventures-in-waiver-exemption/ I still think he's exempt based on when he signed and number of NHL games played. EDIT: the person writing that article noted they updated Grenier's status in that section of the write up, but then hasn't changed the handy table they have at the bottom of the article. So swap Grenier to green/yes for waiver exempt and there you have it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Quantum Posted July 16, 2015 Share Posted July 16, 2015 It seems pretty simple to me. If he's wavier exempt, he'll start in the AHL but be one of the first callups once injuries start happening. If he's not waiver exempt, he'll start in the NHL and Kenins, despite being on a one way deal, will start in the AHL. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
saucypass Posted July 16, 2015 Share Posted July 16, 2015 Cycling was a thing before the Sedins. The europeans used it as a deliberate possession technique like the notorious group called the Russian 5, not to be confused by the Jackson 5, used it in the NHL as well. The slap pass cold very well be a Sedin+Edler+Ehrhoff thing though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SID.IS.SID.ME.IS.ME Posted July 16, 2015 Share Posted July 16, 2015 Grenier is almost certainly waiver exempt this year. And you don't need to slog through the details of CBA Article 13 (Waivers) to understand why. Grenier signed this contract: http://www.generalfanager.com/players/1868 (one-year deal, two-way, $585,000 NHL, $90,000 AHL, $10,000 signing bonus, zero performance bonus) And his qualifying offer (which he rejected) would have been for $715,000 NHL ($74,500 AHL). Grenier's agent negotiated a higher AHL salary in exchange for a lower NHL salary. This is because Grenier fully expects to spend the majority of the 2015-16 season with Utica (because he's waiver exempt and can be sent down without risk). But as far as the CBA goes, here's how I read Grenier's status according to Article 13: http://www.nhl.com/nhl/en/v3/ext/CBA2012/NHL_NHLPA_2013_CBA.pdf Grenier signed his ELC in 2013. He turned 22 during the 2013 "calendar year" so his "signing age" of 22 qualifies him for an exemption, according to the CBA's chart, of 3 years and 70 NHL games. Grenier has zero NHL games to-date. His first pro season, after signing his ELC, was 2013-14 (with Utica). So he's exempt for 2013-14, 2014-15, and 2015-16 (unless he hits the 70 NHL games limit during 2015-16--in which case he immediately becomes subject to waivers). So to be clear: Grenier should remain waiver exempt until he completes a third professional season as a member of the Canucks organization (with that clock starting in 2013--the year he signed his ELC with Vancouver). This makes the coming season (2015-16) his third and final year of waiver exemption. Of course, that's assuming he doesn't make the Canucks out of camp and manage to play 70 NHL games on the NHL roster (in which case he'd lose waiver exemption before the end of the season). But as I suggested at the top, it's pretty clear Grenier expects the Canucks will use his waiver status to send him down for another year in Utica (so it's pretty unlikely he gets a real chance to make the starting roster out of training camp, never mind play 70 games with Vancouver in 2015-16). And that's most likely the reason why his agent chose to negotiate a higher AHL salary (that extra $15,500 does makes a difference to a guy like Grenier), instead of accepting the terms of his QO (which would have actually paid him more at the NHL level). It also helps that (assuming Grenier plays well with the Comets) his relatively low NHL salary ($585,000) should make him a fairly attractive call-up option if/when the team goes through a rash of injuries (and need to carry some extra injury-relief players against their cap). But if Grenier was actually waiver eligible this year, then this factor might well have kept him on an NHL roster for 2015-16 (either with Vancouver or with another team that claimed him off the waiver wire). And if Grenier and his agent felt this was any kind of a possibility, then they probably wouldn't have chosen to forego $130,000 of NHL salary in exchange for $15,500 of AHL salary. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Amish Rake Fighter Posted July 16, 2015 Share Posted July 16, 2015 looks like another one of SID's posts that should be in the Nucks Encyclopedia nobody ends a debate like SID nobody Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
elvis15 Posted July 16, 2015 Share Posted July 16, 2015 ^^^ C'mon, I don't mind scrolling through a SID post, but that's just annoying. Grenier is almost certainly waiver exempt this year. And you don't need to slog through the details of CBA Article 13 (Waivers) to understand why. ... But as I suggested at the top, it's pretty clear Grenier expects the Canucks will use his waiver status to send him down for another year in Utica (so it's pretty unlikely he gets a real chance to make the starting roster out of training camp, never mind play 70 games with Vancouver in 2015-16). And that's most likely the reason why his agent chose to negotiate a higher AHL salary (that extra $15,500 does makes a difference to a guy like Grenier), instead of accepting the terms of his QO (which would have actually paid him more at the NHL level). It also helps that (assuming Grenier plays well with the Comets) his relatively low NHL salary ($585,000) should make him a fairly attractive call-up option if/when the team goes through a rash of injuries (and need to carry some extra injury-relief players against their cap). But if Grenier was actually waiver eligible this year, then this factor might well have kept him on an NHL roster for 2015-16 (either with Vancouver or with another team that claimed him off the waiver wire). And if Grenier and his agent felt this was any kind of a possibility, then they probably wouldn't have chosen to forego $130,000 of NHL salary in exchange for $15,500 of AHL salary. The CBA stuff was my understanding of it as well, but the added aspect of his new contract is a good point. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
elvis15 Posted July 16, 2015 Share Posted July 16, 2015 http://canucksarmy.com/2015/7/16/waiver-exemption-primer-and-2015-2016-canucks-prospects ALEXANDRE GRENIER WAIVER EXEMPT Alex Grenier is a tricky case, but it is verified with the league that he is waivers exempted. Grenier finished his season in the QMJHL. He spent the next year half in Austria and then half in the ECHL. He did play 4 games in the AHL (January and April) but this was before he signed his ELC with the Canucks in May of 2013. As Grenier signed as a 22 year-old he has 3 years of waiver-exemption. He has not yet met his professional games played in the NHL (as he has 0) and he only has 2 years of professional-years played. This means he is exempted from waivers and despite all the positive talk from Benning, I would not be surprised to see him start the year in Utica as well. Pretty much everything I've seen confirms he's exempt, and the only thing I've seen to the contrary was referencing some of the blog explanations of waivers (particularly Pension Plan Puppet's post on waivers) that referenced the eligibility kicking in after the first professional games played. If that included a NA player playing in Europe prior to signing an NHL contract, then Grenier's time in Austria would explain the confusion. But it starts from when he signs his NHL contract, otherwise we'd see guys like Kylington who've played in the SHL from 16-17 be waivers eligible really quickly. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NEON.KNEE Posted July 17, 2015 Share Posted July 17, 2015 I think the Sedins are high iq players. Beyond that, nobody on the Canucks may qualify. In fact, the Sedins might have assisted with the term 'high hockey iq player' being invented. Never really heard the term before the Sedin era. At least not this much overuse. The Sedins have changed the game a bit. Also in use now: Cycling the puck as a deliberate strategy. Maybe I'm giving the Sedins too much credit. Cycling became very mainstream in the NHL in the mid to late 90's via the Legion Of Doom in Philly... Lindros in his prime Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gaudette Celly Posted July 17, 2015 Share Posted July 17, 2015 Sedin, Sedin, Burrows Baer, Bonino, Vrbata Higgins, Horvat, Hansen Dorsett, Vey(?), Prust Good to see some positivity creeping in. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Outsiders Posted July 18, 2015 Share Posted July 18, 2015 Good to see some positivity creeping in. Higgins better be gone or I've lost all faith Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CanuckinEdm Posted July 19, 2015 Share Posted July 19, 2015 Higgins better be gone or I've lost all faith Higgins better not be on the 2nd line, but he better be on the team. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
falcon45ca Posted July 19, 2015 Share Posted July 19, 2015 I think the Sedins are high iq players. Beyond that, nobody on the Canucks may qualify. Vrbata has incredible hockey IQ, look what he did with the Canucks PP this season. Henrik really impressed me with his hockey IQ in '12 when he silenced all doubters as to whether he could play without Daniel...since they're twins, I'm gonna be arrogant & assume that Daniel can likewise play well without Henrik. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bigbadcanucks Posted July 19, 2015 Share Posted July 19, 2015 Vrbata has incredible hockey IQ, look what he did with the Canucks PP this season. Henrik really impressed me with his hockey IQ in '12 when he silenced all doubters as to whether he could play without Daniel...since they're twins, I'm gonna be arrogant & assume that Daniel can likewise play well without Henrik. Can't deny that Vrbata has high hockey IQ, but pity he doesn't have any heart and plays with fear in his eyes when the playoffs roll around. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
falcon45ca Posted July 19, 2015 Share Posted July 19, 2015 Can't deny that Vrbata has high hockey IQ, but pity he doesn't have any heart and plays with fear in his eyes when the playoffs roll around. No argument there, watching Vrbata this past playoffs, I get the feeling he wants to play a long hockey career, not necessarily a trophy filled career. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Archived
This topic is now archived and is closed to further replies.