Expansion draft, who are you keeping ?

[smithers joe]

if i'm seattle, i'm taking lind. we should protect him.

[UKNuck96]

Just now, smithers joe said:

if i'm seattle, i'm taking lind. we should protect him.

While I get there is interest, with an expansion draft a team doesn’t need to pick potential prospects they can take the best possible players, flip those that are not in their plans for picks and use those picks to stock the cupboard, it’s probably far more productive than going for unproven players when they have a whole swath of proven players they can select 

[BCNate]

8 hours ago, janisahockeynut said:

Protected.......................Miller, Pettersson, Boeser, Horvat, Virtanen, Gaudette, and Motte

 

Protected.......................Schmidt, Juolevi and.............. Myers?/Hamonic? (one of these 2) ......If Hamonic is signed before the draft.

 

Protected.......................Demko

 

Exempt Notables ..........Ferland, Hughes, Hoglander, Rathbone, Podkolzin, DiPietro, Woo, Silov, Focht,  and Tryamkin

 

UFA's Exempt................Edler, Pearson, Sutter, Hamonic, Chatfield, Benn, Graovac, and Baertschi

 

Non-Exempt...................Beagle, Roussel, Holtby, Eriksson,, Hawryluk, Michaelis, Bailey, Sauntner, Rafferty, Lind, Jasek, Gadjovich, and Kielly 

 

So, personally, from my understanding Seattle's Pro -picks are between.............

 

Beagle.........................Provides solid leadership, and his a great role model, who can provide PK and F/O

Holtby..........................Probably a lot better goaltenders out there to pick, especially with his age and numbers

Pearson.......................Solid 2/3 winger who is a UFA who can be picked if a contract is negotiated

Sutter...........................Solid 3/4 winger/center who is a UFA who can be picked if a contract is negotiated

Hamonic......................Solid RHD who is defensively responsible who is a UFA who can be picked if a contract is negotiated  \

Lind.............................Break out season in AHL with solid 3rd year numbers..........unproven at NHL level

McEwen......................Big strong winger who has 3/4 upside? Young, eager, with an edge and scoring touch.......unproven at the NHL level

Jasek...........................Defensive Center...............unproven at the NHL level

Gadjovich....................Break out season in AHL showing good goal scoring ability, poor skater, but has improved..........unproven at the NHL level

Chatfield.....................First year part time player.......there will be much better players to take for Defense

 

I am really asking myself, are any Defensemen really worth protecting? Like Really? I like Myers team approach and try, but is he replaceable? Does he bring more than Hamonic, who could be signed pre-draft and protected. Schmidt you protect.

 

Is Myers-Hughes, better than Hamonic-Hughes?

So Myers is worth 6 Million, and Hamonic will sign for 3 million???? Is the difference worth protecting?

 

I expose Myers...............and his 6 million contract

 

The will take either Beagle, Sutter, Myers, Hamonic, or Pearson (will be traded).......probably Sutter (leadership) He will sign for 5 years @ $3 Million per

 

 

Pearson, Sutter and Hamonic won't need protection and can't be taken as they are UFA's.  I assume we will protect Lind over Virtanen, who I expect Seattle will take.

[KirkSave]

Depending on what our roster will look like come the expansion draft, like many other posters I would wager Seattle picks up one of the three below:

 

 

-Myers

-Virtanen

-Holtby

 

Virtanen has great potential, Holtby a solid resume despite struggling the past few seasons and each will only have 1 year left on their current deals. Whereas Myers is a big RD  who can skate, has a good shot and plays in all situtations. Even though his cap hit is high, RD with his size and skill set are highly sought after. 

 

Compared to Vegas and their options to poach a player from us, Seattle will be getting a solid addition to bring aboard.

[IBatch]

Forwards aren't a real issue.

 

D the only thing JB hasn't done yet - and maybe they've already arranged a deal we don't know about yet which is the reason why he isn't bothering with it (yet), is to create a safety net to keep the three best D's we need to protect - which is easily Myers, Schmidt and OJ in that order based on overall play so far.   OJ might be the first (eventually) but as far as sample size goes both for play on our team and overall Schmidt and Myers are both guys our team needs in the lineup.

 

That said the scenarios are endless.   Maybe he's planning to poach a different D - some teams have NMC which actually forces them to expose a better player - so instead of a 4th defenseman -he could be more like a 3rd....that's fantasy GMing which fun - 30 other teams for sure will be competing a little for their leftovers.   If i was Seattle for sure would be picking more Ds then possible to ice - trying them out and then packing a couple or few off later for extras etc.    One thing that has been floated many times by the media and actual GMs, they learned from the Seattle draft and won't be giving up extras just to protect a certain player (as much anyways)...will have to wait and see - but i for one think losing Myers is going really hurt the team.   Does a little of everything well - exactly what you hope for in a top four defenseman.   His price isn't nearly as an issue as some folks seem to think.   What do Brodin, Trouba and Petry and Dumba make anyways?   Schmidt too for that matter...R hand D's of his caliber ... he's factually in the top 15 or so guys available points wise....hmmm.   What would that actually make him?  A top 15 first pairing D - but some think he's a decent third pairing guy lol. 

[UKNuck96]

24 minutes ago, IBatch said:

Forwards aren't a real issue.

 

D the only thing JB hasn't done yet - and maybe they've already arranged a deal we don't know about yet which is the reason why he isn't bothering with it (yet), is to create a safety net to keep the three best D's we need to protect - which is easily Myers, Schmidt and OJ in that order based on overall play so far.   OJ might be the first (eventually) but as far as sample size goes both for play on our team and overall Schmidt and Myers are both guys our team needs in the lineup.

 

That said the scenarios are endless.   Maybe he's planning to poach a different D - some teams have NMC which actually forces them to expose a better player - so instead of a 4th defenseman -he could be more like a 3rd....that's fantasy GMing which fun - 30 other teams for sure will be competing a little for their leftovers.   If i was Seattle for sure would be picking more Ds then possible to ice - trying them out and then packing a couple or few off later for extras etc.    One thing that has been floated many times by the media and actual GMs, they learned from the Seattle draft and won't be giving up extras just to protect a certain player (as much anyways)...will have to wait and see - but i for one think losing Myers is going really hurt the team.   Does a little of everything well - exactly what you hope for in a top four defenseman.   His price isn't nearly as an issue as some folks seem to think.   What do Brodin, Trouba and Petry and Dumba make anyways?   Schmidt too for that matter...R hand D's of his caliber ... he's factually in the top 15 or so guys available points wise....hmmm.   What would that actually make him?  A top 15 first pairing D - but some think he's a decent third pairing guy lol. 

Some people see the salary and decide it’s to much, and because it’s to much he must be junk. 

[IBatch]

9 minutes ago, UKNuck96 said:

Some people see the salary and decide it’s to much, and because it’s to much he must be junk. 

Yes.   Edler and Schmidt make the same pretty much... because that's what they've earned during their careers respect and wage wise.   Don't like this second contract money becoming third contract money  - a trend that Dubas started and almost ruined it for everyone.   Keller got it too.   Thankfully the rest of the league must have got together in solidarity - and survived BB year of second contracts - but most deals happened at the last minute...they seemed to have nipped it on the butt for now at least.   Covid will for sure also help keep it in check.   Have zero issue with contracts line EK and Tavares got.   Why?  Because they've earned it.  Stamkos and a bunch of others too.   Second contract money is supposed to be the maximum value a team gets with their core players coming up ... they for sure shouldn't be paid for what they haven't done yet at least.   Then get their legacy deals as a free agent.   That's the system which only works if GMs stick to it - and it's one that for me at least - makes the most sense.   Myers absolutely earned his UFA deal.   Maybe because there are 50% less natural RHDs in the league he gets a small premium - of 500k.... why quibble over that?    Rather have him then Trouba at 8 x 8 or whatever - right?  

[J.I.A.H.N]

1 hour ago, BCNate said:

Pearson, Sutter and Hamonic won't need protection and can't be taken as they are UFA's.  I assume we will protect Lind over Virtanen, who I expect Seattle will take.

I could be wrong, but I thought I read somewhere, that Seattle will have 3 days before the Expansion draft to approach UFA's to see if they are interested, and if they are, can sign them, and that that signing will count as Seattle's pick from that team. I would imagine if true, that it was put in to discourage circumvention of the Expansion Draft, with UFA's.

 

If I am wrong and that is not the case, then yes, you are right, and I am mistaken.

 

Cheers!

[Devron]

If Myers is exposed he’s gone. Guarantee it. For some I’m sure they would like that but it would be a huge hit to our defence. Careful what you wish for 

[J.I.A.H.N]

1 hour ago, IBatch said:

Forwards aren't a real issue.

 

D the only thing JB hasn't done yet - and maybe they've already arranged a deal we don't know about yet which is the reason why he isn't bothering with it (yet), is to create a safety net to keep the three best D's we need to protect - which is easily Myers, Schmidt and OJ in that order based on overall play so far.   OJ might be the first (eventually) but as far as sample size goes both for play on our team and overall Schmidt and Myers are both guys our team needs in the lineup.

 

That said the scenarios are endless.   Maybe he's planning to poach a different D - some teams have NMC which actually forces them to expose a better player - so instead of a 4th defenseman -he could be more like a 3rd....that's fantasy GMing which fun - 30 other teams for sure will be competing a little for their leftovers.   If i was Seattle for sure would be picking more Ds then possible to ice - trying them out and then packing a couple or few off later for extras etc.    One thing that has been floated many times by the media and actual GMs, they learned from the Seattle draft and won't be giving up extras just to protect a certain player (as much anyways)...will have to wait and see - but i for one think losing Myers is going really hurt the team.   Does a little of everything well - exactly what you hope for in a top four defenseman.   His price isn't nearly as an issue as some folks seem to think.   What do Brodin, Trouba and Petry and Dumba make anyways?   Schmidt too for that matter...R hand D's of his caliber ... he's factually in the top 15 or so guys available points wise....hmmm.   What would that actually make him?  A top 15 first pairing D - but some think he's a decent third pairing guy lol. 

HI IBatch

 

As you can see with my above post, I am questioning our defensive corp. I certainly see the attributes of Myers, when compared to our other Dmen, but I question exactly how strong they are as a group? There must be some reason why we have so much trouble keeping the shot count down.

 

I am of the opinion, that our left side is complete, in Hughes, Juolevi, and Rathbone (IMO we will get above defense for 10+ years, when complete), and it is our right side that needs to be built. So, I wonder exactly, if there are any Dmen there, who would actually fit with our rebuilding of that side? I am not saying I am right, as much as these are my questions regarding that. I think you have to look at age, and ability to get that answer. 

 

Please note, that my thoughts are looking forward 2 years, as this is more important than where we are at this moment. (Taking into account that Myers may be good enough even next year), but where does he fit going forwards? And is there replacements available at a lesser value?

[Laoag]

1 hour ago, BCNate said:

Pearson, Sutter and Hamonic won't need protection and can't be taken as they are UFA's.  I assume we will protect Lind over Virtanen, who I expect Seattle will take.

I don't think we need to protect Lind? I know the fan base is crying for the team to call the likes of Lind and Gadjovich up to the NHL and "play the kids" if this is a lost season, but maybe... just maybe... management is thinking ahead an not allowing them to play the needed games to be exposed. nothing wrong with over ripening in the AHL During a throw away season.

from what I am understanding... there are literally no big pieces we can lose from this expansion draft. we're actually in a position to poach a young Dman or forward another team won't want to lose for nothing.

Ive protected  Boeser, Bo, Miller, Virtanen (he still has trade value and potential, it would be stupid to expose him.), Motte, Pettersson. Leaves room for one more... id assume gaudette but really... if we can trade for an asset a team doesn't want to lose and its more valuable than gaudette that would be ideal. I don't see long term potential in gaudette, not on a Stanley cup winning team at least.

back end is even easier.

Schmidt and Olli, that's all they NEED to protect. if they can get Hamonic signed to a deal that works out that I think that would be good going forward.

goalie... Demko DUHH

out of the exposed players. if I am Seattle, I am seriously thinking of taking Myers. I know the fan base loves to rip into him but he is a very serviceable NHL D-man. do I like his cap hit? not really, but for an expansion team, I don't think that's an issue. Seattle won't be like Vegas they will not make it to the Stanley cup final in the first year. teams around the league will have learned. instead of teams allowing Seattle to bend them over a barrel like they did with Vegas, I think they will be smarter and trade with each other.

Canucks losing Myers will be a hit don't get me wrong, I really like Myers. but if our window for true Stanley cup contention is in 2 years, Myers will be 33 @ 6 million, not exactly a Value contract. I have full confidence Olli to fill the space Myers currently occupies in 2 years time.


this year has sucked, the play getting better is welcome but I don't know if its enough to make the playoffs (hoping to be wrong). if we truly want to compete in 2 years time, this is a perfect year to take that step back and get a higher draft pick, that could potentially big a big contributing factor going forward on a ELC.

My 2 cents....

[kanucks25]

1 hour ago, IBatch said:

that's fantasy GMing which fun - 30 other teams for sure will be competing a little for their leftovers.

Not every team is in a position that we are; we have extra protection slots available and potentially a player that is exposure-requirement-eligible available for trade.

 

We should have some leverage in this situation.

 

1 hour ago, IBatch said:

One thing that has been floated many times by the media and actual GMs, they learned from the Seattle draft and won't be giving up extras just to protect a certain player (as much anyways)...will have to wait and see

On the other hand, some teams gave away a good player to Vegas without even really trying to think outside the box on how they could salvage the situation. That's where we can swoop in.

 

1 hour ago, IBatch said:

What do Brodin, Trouba and Petry and Dumba make anyways? Schmidt too for that matter

Schmidt, Brodin and Petry are objectively better players, the latter is a Norris candidate this year... I've yet to see anybody put Myers in the Norris conversation so I'm not sure how that's a comparable?

 

Dumba is probably the best comparable but he signed his contract coming out of a bridge deal @ 23 and in his final year of that previous contract he had 50 points which Myers has only come close to once: in his rookie season over a decade ago. When we signed Myers he had already played over 600 games in the NHL, so there was no secret as to what kind of player he was or what his worth is cap wise.

 

Trouba has a bad contract. A bad contract on another team doesn't justify a bad contract on our team.

 

1 hour ago, IBatch said:

he's factually in the top 15 or so guys available points wise....hmmm.   What would that actually make him?  A top 15 first pairing D - but some think he's a decent third pairing guy lol.

Yes, because points are everything for a D-man. 

 

Myers is a good offensively and is a decent overall player. Again, I'm not saying he's not valuable to the team (especially right now with the way the roster looks) but that 6Mx4Y can be used more effectively elsewhere, perhaps a long-term partner for Hughes.

Edited March 14, 2021 by kanucks25

[Laoag]

24 minutes ago, Devron44 said:

If Myers is exposed he’s gone. Guarantee it. For some I’m sure they would like that but it would be a huge hit to our defence. Careful what you wish for 

Just posted this I agree completely. Myers is a good piece, he will be claimed.

my thinking is... if management is serious about going for the cup starting in 2 years, we need to rip the bandaid off and let Seattle take him, create the cap flexibility. on the flip side... if the are going to spend assets to get better for next year and be more "competitive" NEXT year... we can't afford to lose him.

the real question on what to do on the back end is: is there actually a real plan and are they going to stick to their guns?

[kanucks25]

9 hours ago, Nucksownyou said:

No, it's you who needs to sort out his lunch. AHL counts as pro games required, so they are eligible. Thanks for proving my point.

Glad @mll educated you here so I didn't have to waste my time with this garbage lol

 

Go Canucks 

[canuckleheads fan]

2 hours ago, Chris12345 said:

Cause he could sign directly with Seattle without the bs. He has the leverage so he should ask for a nmc till Dec 1.

Because it's unlikely he would be picked, and Vancouver is probably going to be a better team over the next two seasons. It is more likely Seattle either picks Holtby as a proven starter or one of the younger players that we can't protect. Just because the Canucks expose him doesn't mean he'll get taken.

[UFCanuck]

Seattle is going to have a MAF/Holtby tandem. They're already better than half the league.

[billabong]

Myers has been pretty good this year, he’s had some ugly games but he would need to go out into free agency and just replace him with a similar caliber player 

 

Could see Canucks resigning hamonic or benn for expansion requirements and add depth to the D 

 

seattle I’m guessing is looking at lind, beagle and holtby. 

[RU SERIOUS]

I say Seattle is "Frothing at the Mouth" to get Lucky Loui !  (He's a Bulldog !!!!)

Edited March 14, 2021 by RU SERIOUS

[IBatch]

2 hours ago, janisahockeynut said:

HI IBatch

 

As you can see with my above post, I am questioning our defensive corp. I certainly see the attributes of Myers, when compared to our other Dmen, but I question exactly how strong they are as a group? There must be some reason why we have so much trouble keeping the shot count down.

 

I am of the opinion, that our left side is complete, in Hughes, Juolevi, and Rathbone (IMO we will get above defense for 10+ years, when complete), and it is our right side that needs to be built. So, I wonder exactly, if there are any Dmen there, who would actually fit with our rebuilding of that side? I am not saying I am right, as much as these are my questions regarding that. I think you have to look at age, and ability to get that answer. 

 

Please note, that my thoughts are looking forward 2 years, as this is more important than where we are at this moment. (Taking into account that Myers may be good enough even next year), but where does he fit going forwards? And is there replacements available at a lesser value?

Your posts are always good reads...Ideally the team can sign Hamilton and Seattle takes Myers - for sure the best RHD available - he's turning into a bit of a beast and a top ten RHD the last couple years.   That would be great ... was hoping Brodin or Petry would be available ... do appreciate that we could do a lot better - it's the part of the team that needs the most work, that and centre depth post Sutter etc...
 

Overall the future looks bright - Woo is a possibly and Lind, Podz, Rathbone there for sure are finishing touches that look to coming in.   Just so difficult to find these guys (RHDs), IF Myers was our 3rd paring D - same with Edler, and the guys above them were just as solid all around we'd be set for the next two or three years.    Understand the desire to see a better D core...OJ and Rathbone ... yes our left side looks set. 

[J.I.A.H.N]

2 hours ago, IBatch said:

Your posts are always good reads...Ideally the team can sign Hamilton and Seattle takes Myers - for sure the best RHD available - he's turning into a bit of a beast and a top ten RHD the last couple years.   That would be great ... was hoping Brodin or Petry would be available ... do appreciate that we could do a lot better - it's the part of the team that needs the most work, that and centre depth post Sutter etc...
 

Overall the future looks bright - Woo is a possibly and Lind, Podz, Rathbone there for sure are finishing touches that look to coming in.   Just so difficult to find these guys (RHDs), IF Myers was our 3rd paring D - same with Edler, and the guys above them were just as solid all around we'd be set for the next two or three years.    Understand the desire to see a better D core...OJ and Rathbone ... yes our left side looks set. 

Here is that scenario as it appears in my head.....(Quite a dream,. actually! LOL)

 

So, in this dream, here is how it plays out..........

We re-sign Hamonic, and keep Schmidt until the summer

then expose Myers (big Salary) to which Seattle takes

Then in the summer after Myers is gone, we sign Hamilton

and we sign Tryamkin.......................

Then we trade Schmidt (People ask why? I say to control cap and acquire

a very important piece (a 3rd line center), which Schmidt brings in easily

This brings us a 3rd line center and a 2022 pick

Now we are looking at a RHD side of.............Hamilton, Hamonic, Tryamkin

Our right side defensive cap is.............now 8, 2, and 2, so........12 Million............it is at the moment, 11 million for Schmidt, Myers, and Hamonic

I have to say, that the up grade is that Hamilton is a top 15 type RHD and is 28, and should be good until he is 34 or 35 

I would also be looking for a 4th piece, who fits in...........I am looking for size and cheap

But not only is Hamilton the up grade, but the Schmidt trade for a 3rd line center can not be dismissed as small.

So, in the end, you up grade 3rd line Center and your #1 RHD..............

 

So, yes, that is how I deal with it

But I don't trade Schmidt, until I have Hamilton under contract

The right side I go with youth.............Hughes, Juolevi and Rathbone

 

IMO, this gives us alot of time to prepare for the next defensive core, and be absolutely ready for this core

 

 

 

 

 

 

Edited March 14, 2021 by janisahockeynut