[Rumour] Bo Horvat Trade/Contract Talks

[DownUndaCanuck]

8 hours ago, Coconuts said:

This doesn't really address our defense though, even if you somehow nab Peeke that right side doesn't look particularly strong. One of the biggest issues for the Canucks, with the roster they've currently got, is that too much cap is allocated to the forward group. 

 

Bear doesn't strike me as a top 4 lock, he looks more like a 5-4 tweener at best who can step up and play that role if you don't have anyone better. Which.. in our top 4.. we currently don't. Hard to say what Rathbone is too, not sure I'd project him as a full time NHL'er. Fortunately we have plenty of depth/bottom pairing guys in the system at the moment. That defense really don't look much better than what we've got now though, and what we have now isn't good enough as is imo. 

While I do agree with this, and have said before we are 2 top-4 defencemen away from being taken seriously, I just don't see this management group able to get us 2 D-men and shed Myers all in the same calendar year.

 

100% agree that we have too much cap allocated to forwards. It's not just cap though, look at our drafting - we have criminally ignored the defence position for almost a decade and now we're paying for it. 

[stawns]

8 hours ago, DownUndaCanuck said:

While I do agree with this, and have said before we are 2 top-4 defencemen away from being taken seriously, I just don't see this management group able to get us 2 D-men and shed Myers all in the same calendar year.

 

100% agree that we have too much cap allocated to forwards. It's not just cap though, look at our drafting - we have criminally ignored the defence position for almost a decade and now we're paying for it. 

Had oj not been derailed by injury, he'd likely be a top 3 dman right now.  That said, I'm not a big fan of drafting dmen unless it's with a top 10-15 pick 

[D.B Cooper]

1 minute ago, stawns said:

Had oj not been derailed by injury, he'd likely be a top 3 dman right now.  That said, I'm not a big fan of drafting dmen unless it's with a top 10-15 pick 

Gotta disagree.  
The kid had major motivation issues. 
Showing up to camp out of shape 3 years in a row was more damaging than his injuries. 

[Locke Lamora]

55 minutes ago, stawns said:

Had oj not been derailed by injury, he'd likely be a top 3 dman right now. 

Lol, no. His injury saga was likely a result of his lack of professionalism in terms of training and dedication. I’ll never forget a quote by Sami Salo when he had OJ in Finland for a bit, where he basically commented that OJ didn’t understand the importance of fitness. 

[stawns]

11 minutes ago, Locke Lamora said:

Lol, no. His injury saga was likely a result of his lack of professionalism in terms of training and dedication. I’ll never forget a quote by Sami Salo when he had OJ in Finland for a bit, where he basically commented that OJ didn’t understand the importance of fitness. 

Sure

[Locke Lamora]

15 minutes ago, stawns said:

Sure

Happy to help.

[BPA]

Read an article that said Carolina is looking to trade out Kot to make room for Bo.

[Alflives]

7 minutes ago, BPA said:

Read an article that said Carolina is looking to trade out Kot to make room for Bo.

Would we do Bo for Kotkaniemi + +?  

[steviewonder20]

42 minutes ago, Alflives said:

Would we do Bo for Kotkaniemi + +?  

He doesn’t address our greatest need, would rather have a pick and a top 4 rhd. Not sure our new  management group likes collecting picks rather than trading them, despite acknowledging our empty cupboard of prospects. Would love Morrow, Drury and a first round pick from them instead for Bo.

Edited November 26, 2022 by steviewonder20

[aGENT]

53 minutes ago, BPA said:

Read an article that said Carolina is looking to trade out Kot to make room for Bo.

He'd have largely "neutral" value in trade, but sure. I wouldn't view him as any large part of the return though.

 

But something like  Kotkaniemi, Morrow, Drury their 1st, one of Seeley/Heimosalmi/Nikishin Gardiner's LTIR for Horvat + say Kuzmenko. Yup

Edited November 26, 2022 by aGENT

[Coconuts]

14 hours ago, DownUndaCanuck said:

While I do agree with this, and have said before we are 2 top-4 defencemen away from being taken seriously, I just don't see this management group able to get us 2 D-men and shed Myers all in the same calendar year.

 

100% agree that we have too much cap allocated to forwards. It's not just cap though, look at our drafting - we have criminally ignored the defence position for almost a decade and now we're paying for it. 

It's unlikely they could juggle the cap appropriately and acquire two such players, I agree. If we're to play stopgaps though they need to be on shorter term deals. 

 

And absolutely, this franchises unwillingness to draft D with 1st or 2nd round picks, or to even use their old 2nd round picks more often than not, has hurt us. The last impact D we drafted prior to Hughes was Edler. 

[Coconuts]

1 hour ago, BPA said:

Read an article that said Carolina is looking to trade out Kot to make room for Bo.

Wouldn't be interested in him but Carolina is the landing spot that makes the most sense for Horvat in terms of the other team needing him and being able to actually pay up good assets. KK isn't cutting it as a 2C, Horvat could put a team that's close over the top. 

 

That's a lot of cap commitment, not sure I'd be willing to take him on. They'd have to pay really good. 

Edited November 26, 2022 by Coconuts

[Alflives]

1 minute ago, Coconuts said:

Wouldn't be interested in him but Carolina is the landing spot that makes the most sense for Horvat in terms of the other team needing him and being able to actually pay up good assets. KK isn't cutting it as a 2C, Horvat could put a team that's close over the top. 

I’d be very happy if we did Bo + Bone for KK + Morrow + a first.  That’s a trade that kind of is sideways up front and we get a younger right shot prospect for Bone.  Hell, I’d do it without the first.  Or make the first conditional on Bo’s extending with the Canes.  

[Coconuts]

6 minutes ago, Alflives said:

I’d be very happy if we did Bo + Bone for KK + Morrow + a first.  That’s a trade that kind of is sideways up front and we get a younger right shot prospect for Bone.  Hell, I’d do it without the first.  Or make the first conditional on Bo’s extending with the Canes.  

I'm all for trading Rathbone but we lose that trade, Morrow is a great prospect but KK is an unknown with huge term and that 1st is probably on the lower end. Carolina liked him enough to give him that term, doesn't mean he's currently worth what he's earning. He's got 4 points through 21 games and earns almost 5M. He's got the potential to be better but he's not currently better. Carolina would need to add imo. 

Edited November 26, 2022 by Coconuts

[BPA]

Kot only has something like 4pts in 20 games.  CDC would eat him alive.  Especially since he’s about $5M with 8yrs.  YIKES!!!

 

[AnthonyG]

7 hours ago, Locke Lamora said:

Lol, no. His injury saga was likely a result of his lack of professionalism in terms of training and dedication. I’ll never forget a quote by Sami Salo when he had OJ in Finland for a bit, where he basically commented that OJ didn’t understand the importance of fitness. 

Can you link that quote?

[Locke Lamora]

4 minutes ago, AnthonyG said:

Can you link that quote?

Not sure I’ll be able to find it, but it was from a Salo interview from Finland. He was very forthright about Olli needing to be more committed to his conditioning. I remember it made a few waves here on CDC….the usual Juolevi defenders/critics going at it. 

 

But don’t mind me, get back to your regularly scheduled Bo Horvat trade/contract speculation!

[DownUndaCanuck]

Hoping Bo doesn't get traded and we sign him to a solid 8M deal butttt there's talk that Kane goes for a 1st, prospect and mid round pick (say 3rd). 

 

I think if JR deals Bo that prospect and mid pick would combine to a young roster player, but surely Bo carries a lot more value than a rental, old Kane, so I wonder if his value is a 1st, young player (say 20-24yo) and decent (B grade) prospect. That's a heck of a lot coming back.

 

When you look at Detroit you could be talking about a 1st, Veleno and a decent defensive prospect like Wallinder (probably not their top guy Edvinsson). 

 

I'd obviously rather he re-sign but that sort of deal can set your future up nicely if we're still flailing near the TDL.

[rekker]

16 hours ago, BPA said:

Kot only has something like 4pts in 20 games.  CDC would eat him alive.  Especially since he’s about $5M with 8yrs.  YIKES!!!

 

Big now to Kot. Going back to a Canadian market is definitely not the remedy for what ails this kid. 

Edited November 27, 2022 by rekker

[Coconuts]

5 hours ago, DownUndaCanuck said:

Hoping Bo doesn't get traded and we sign him to a solid 8M deal butttt there's talk that Kane goes for a 1st, prospect and mid round pick (say 3rd). 

 

I think if JR deals Bo that prospect and mid pick would combine to a young roster player, but surely Bo carries a lot more value than a rental, old Kane, so I wonder if his value is a 1st, young player (say 20-24yo) and decent (B grade) prospect. That's a heck of a lot coming back.

 

When you look at Detroit you could be talking about a 1st, Veleno and a decent defensive prospect like Wallinder (probably not their top guy Edvinsson). 

 

I'd obviously rather he re-sign but that sort of deal can set your future up nicely if we're still flailing near the TDL.

Hard to say. Kane, at 33 last season, put up 92 points. He's got a much better track record of producing. He's been well over point per game the last four seasons, at 16 in 20 on a lousy Chicago team thus far it's not farfetched to think he'll do it again. 

 

That being said, the teams looking at Kane may not be the same teams looking at Horvat as they play different positions and fit different needs. Teams like Colorado and Carolina who could use a center are much more likely to look at Bo, maybe Boston too. Maybe a team that's relatively set down the middle like Pittsburgh, New Jersey, Dallas, or Winnipeg makes a play for Kane. 

 

Bo could bring back quite a haul though, no question. I think he does. 

Edited November 27, 2022 by Coconuts