Olli Juolevi | #48 | D

[Lancaster]

Any Euro leagues that play with NHL-size ice?  

Playing against men is great as the competition is higher.... but unless he has the opportunity to actually battle more along the boards, fight for space, etc... overseas might not help that much.  

[Alflives]

6 minutes ago, Lancaster said:

Any Euro leagues that play with NHL-size ice?  

Playing against men is great as the competition is higher.... but unless he has the opportunity to actually battle more along the boards, fight for space, etc... overseas might not help that much.  

I heard in Finland their rinks for the pros is a hybrid.

[wshdrvvn]

6 hours ago, Boudrias said:

I can see the appeal of OJ playing against professionals. That said I prefer another year in London playing for Hunter. NHL quality coaching. He played OJ as his d-side #1 and then played him at both ends during the Mem Cup. Joulevi answered the bell both on the PP and PK. Many OHL teams play at a quasi pro level. The size of many of these players is incredible. 

 

To me hockey has always been more about limiting mistakes rather than pure offense. Joulevi's OHL career has covered the full range of the game. Because London will have a offensive players a year older I expect a more offensive game. Joulevi should end his OHL career with a well rounded game. 

why play at a quasi pro level when you can play at a pro pro level?  New year, new challenges.  

[Legendary10]

19 hours ago, Eastcoast meets Westcoast said:

If asked Edler will waive. Edler has been with this team for over a decade, he can see the direction the club is headed and as pointed to above, JB makes trades that seem to place players in good situations in other clubs. 

 

However Edler would be the prefect mentor for OJ, and he could take the harder minutes to allow OJ some room to grow and adjust to the league. 

 

OJ could overtake Hutton. Hutton will have to come into camp like a man on Fire. IMO OJ has thrown down a challenge and is doing exactly what he needs to do to

make the club this year. 

 

With a  young player as good as OJ doing everything he needs to to make the team, this puts Hutton on the hot seat. 

 

Hutton is the prefect guy to put into the second pairing for the next decade, but MDZ makes Huttom somewhat expendable if OJ wins a spot. 

 

Edler can mentor OJ and take the harder minutes.  OJ could go a long way to improving our PP and if paired 5v5 with Guddy, should get through the season without getting targeted. 

 

EmW

 

 

 

 

Why wouldn't you just trade MDZ and keep a younger Hutton who has much more potential and already well liked amounsgt his teammates?

[24K PureCool]

39 minutes ago, Legendary10 said:

Why wouldn't you just trade MDZ and keep a younger Hutton who has much more potential and already well liked amounsgt his teammates?

Cause you do not trade a FA you just signed during the summer. That is a sure fire way to have future FA avoid the team.

[Putgolzin]

With the thought that Dahlen and Petersson could play on the same team in the SHL...I know it's not likely, but could it be possible that Juolevi could sign there as well?

[Diamonds]

16 hours ago, Lancaster said:

Any Euro leagues that play with NHL-size ice?  

Playing against men is great as the competition is higher.... but unless he has the opportunity to actually battle more along the boards, fight for space, etc... overseas might not help that much.  

I don't know much about the ice size, but I know the Finnish league is supposed to be the more physical of the Euro leagues. So in that sense the Finnish league (Liiga) would probably be the best choice.

[canuckledraggin]

17 hours ago, Lancaster said:

Any Euro leagues that play with NHL-size ice?  

Playing against men is great as the competition is higher.... but unless he has the opportunity to actually battle more along the boards, fight for space, etc... overseas might not help that much.  

http://hfboards.hockeysfuture.com/archive/index.php/t-1182217.html

 

Finnish players should used to playing in different arenas with all of those different rink sizes, damn.

Edited July 29, 2017 by canuckledraggin

[Ihatetomatoes]

22 hours ago, Hutton Wink said:

Where's these reports of Edler refusing to waive, and was it during the current regime?

Not sure, As with the majority of times when it comes to asking a player to waive his NTC it won't be made public because obviously you don't want to have a player on your team have to deal with the media if you made it public that you asked him to waive his NTC and he refused. If I remember right is was someone with ties to the team making reports that they asked Edler to waive and he said no, there won't be definitive proof.  I don't remember if it was this regime or not but it's more the player than the regime. Like I said before Edler is a notoriously shy person and if there is one guy who wouldn't waive his NTC just for personal reasons it would be him. Maybe he will change his tune with the obvious rebuild happening or maybe he is comfortable with his life in Vancouver and wants to go down with the ship like the Sedins. 

Edited July 29, 2017 by Ihatetomatoes

[aGENT]

18 minutes ago, Ihatetomatoes said:

Not sure, As with the majority of times when it comes to asking a player to waive his NTC it won't be made public because obviously you don't want to have a player on your team have to deal with the media if you made it public that you asked him to waive his NTC and he refused. If I remember right is was someone with ties to the team making reports that they asked Edler to waive and he said no, there won't be definitive proof.  I don't remember if it was this regime or not but it's more the player than the regime. Like I said before Edler is a notoriously shy person and if there is one guy who wouldn't waive his NTC just for personal reasons it would be him. Maybe he will change his tune with the obvious rebuild happening or maybe he is comfortable with his life in Vancouver and wants to go down with the ship like the Sedins. 

Bieksa wanted to 'go down with the ship' too. 

 

He's now a Duck. 

Edited July 29, 2017 by J.R.

[pluralsight]

10 hours ago, 24K PureCool said:

Cause you do not trade a FA you just signed during the summer. That is a sure fire way to have future FA avoid the team.

Marco Sturm says hello. But yes, I generally agree with this. 

[c00kies]

4 minutes ago, pluralsight said:

Marco Sturm says hello. But yes, I generally agree with this. 

Sturm played like 18 games with us and I don't even think he scored a goal lol.

 

Edit: Way off lol. 6 games, -5 with 2PIMs. No points.

Edited July 29, 2017 by c00kies

[pluralsight]

1 minute ago, c00kies said:

Sturm played like 18 games with us and I don't even think he scored a goal lol.

 

Edit: Way off lol. 6 games, -5 with 2PIMs. No points.

If we didn't sign Sturm, we never would have gotten the legendary David Booth. 

[Phat Fingers]

16 hours ago, Legendary10 said:

Why wouldn't you just trade MDZ and keep a younger Hutton who has much more potential and already well liked amounsgt his teammates?

I don't believe that JB would go out and sign a guy for 3 years and then trade him at the start of the season.  

 

That's a rare occurance and the last time something like that happened in Van was with Schnieder (the defence man) and those were dark days. 

 

Hutton may also have value because of the very attributes that you just mentioned. 

 

Hutton is well worth keeping, but I just don't see MDZ being moved this year unless he initiates the move. 

 

If it comes down to OJ vs Hutton vs Edler, well lots to weigh out. Edler is a good solid defender who can help OJ transition into the NHL, Hutton is still transitioning, so he is less of a mentor and more of a equal. 

 

Hutton fits way better into the time line and has added a lot of size to his frame in the past few years and showed some improvement in his defensive game towards the end of last season. 

 

Tough call, but then again Edler has an NTC and higher cap hit. Hutton is way easier to trade.  If OJ comes into camp good to go and beats out one or both, Someone is getting traded. 

 

EmW

 

 

[Ihatetomatoes]

8 hours ago, J.R. said:

Bieksa wanted to 'go down with the ship' too. 

 

He's now a Duck. 

Ya but it was never reported he refused to waive his NTC. He was just asked if he would want to leave if the Canucks were rebuilding like Kesler did, he replied he would go down with the ship. Different case than Edler who has reportedly refused to waive his NTC. 

[Gaudette Celly]

2 hours ago, Ihatetomatoes said:

Ya but it was never reported he refused to waive his NTC. He was just asked if he would want to leave if the Canucks were rebuilding like Kesler did, he replied he would go down with the ship. Different case than Edler who has reportedly refused to waive his NTC. 

And there was never a report that Edler was ever asked to or refused to waive, that I've ever seen.  A single comment he made after signing his extension is irrelevant, especially in light of comments he made only a few months afterwards.

[SID.IS.SID.ME.IS.ME]

2 hours ago, Hutton Wink said:

And there was never a report that Edler was ever asked to or refused to waive, that I've ever seen.  A single comment he made after signing his extension is irrelevant, especially in light of comments he made only a few months afterwards.

Edler also made a more recent comment to the effect that if the team makes it clear they no longer want him he would not stick around. I can't find the source but I remember it quite distinctly.

 

Basically, it seems like he wouldn't use his NTC to block a trade outright. If really pushed, he would move.

 

That said, I do believe the "push" would have to be quite a hard one (as Edler clearly wants to stay in Vancouver), and I'm not sure management would want to apply that level of force.

 

I can't see it being popular in the room (especially while the Sedins are here) and could see things getting nasty if Benning really leaned hard on Edler (which doesn't seem to be JB's MO when it comes to the veteran core guys).

 

EDIT: At least not until Edler is in his final year. At that point, I could see them coming to an agreement to move him at the TDL. Especially if it was made clear that he's not in the future plans and won't be re-signed.

Edited July 30, 2017 by SID.IS.SID.ME.IS.ME

[Boudrias]

8 hours ago, SID.IS.SID.ME.IS.ME said:

Edler also made a more recent comment to the effect that if the team makes it clear they no longer want him he would not stick around. I can't find the source but I remember it quite distinctly.

 

Basically, it seems like he wouldn't use his NTC to block a trade outright. If really pushed, he would move.

 

That said, I do believe the "push" would have to be quite a hard one (as Edler clearly wants to stay in Vancouver), and I'm not sure management would want to apply that level of force.

 

I can't see it being popular in the room (especially while the Sedins are here) and could see things getting nasty if Benning really leaned hard on Edler (which doesn't seem to be JB's MO when it comes to the veteran core guys).

 

EDIT: At least not until Edler is in his final year. At that point, I could see them coming to an agreement to move him at the TDL. Especially if it was made clear that he's not in the future plans and won't be re-signed.

Team morale and culture is always something to consider. It can also be overstated. The over riding objective within the org has to be winning a CUP. All players should be evaluated and developed in that light. No player is more important or is owed more than the org winning a CUP. I was a big Habs fan growing up and often wondered why Sammy Pollock moved a fav of mine. He won CUPs and that why Montreal was legendary. 

 

In this light I would have exposed both the Twins to Vegas. The odds of Vegas taking a Sedin knowing the other would not be coming or that they would likely retire should have been a move worth risking. Instead the team lost Sbisa. A young d-man lost for nothing. Who knows what conversations were had? 

 

I believe Edler stated at one time that he had never been asked to waive his NTC. Since my theme is all about the Team and not individual players if Benning was approached with a deal for Edler, and it was worth it, Edler should be asked to waive. NTC's were developed to give players some say in where they might be moved if traded. Good for them. Orgs should be up front with players about their priorities. Suggestions that Jim Benning would not even broach the subject of trade because of a NMC or NTC is naive. Yes, if asked I do think Edler would waive. Since he is still heere then any proposal has not been worth it to JB.   

Edited July 30, 2017 by Boudrias

[SID.IS.SID.ME.IS.ME]

3 hours ago, Boudrias said:

Team morale and culture is always something to consider. It can also be overstated. The over riding objective within the org has to be winning a CUP. All players should be evaluated and developed in that light. No player is more important or is owed more than the org winning a CUP. I was a big Habs fan growing up and often wondered why Sammy Pollock moved a fav of mine. He won CUPs and that why Montreal was legendary. 

 

In this light I would have exposed both the Twins to Vegas. The odds of Vegas taking a Sedin knowing the other would not be coming or that they would likely retire should have been a move worth risking. Instead the team lost Sbisa. A young d-man lost for nothing. Who knows what conversations were had? 

 

I believe Edler stated at one time that he had never been asked to waive his NTC. Since my theme is all about the Team and not individual players if Benning was approached with a deal for Edler, and it was worth it, Edler should be asked to waive. NTC's were developed to give players some say in where they might be moved if traded. Good for them. Orgs should be up front with players about their priorities. Suggestions that Jim Benning would not even broach the subject of trade because of a NMC or NTC is naive. Yes, if asked I do think Edler would waive. Since he is still heere then any proposal has not been worth it to JB.   

I agree that Edler would waive, but only if pressured to do so. If simply approached about the possibility, I think his initial response would be that he has no interest in moving. Management would need to make it clear that he's not in their plans and they no longer want him on the team. At that point, Edler likely gives a short list of destinations to facilitate a trade.

 

It could be done. But it could potentially get messy if handled indelicately. That doesn't be necessarily mean it shouldn't happen. I think an Edler trade, at some point between now and the end of his contract, makes sense given where this team is headed. But JB would need to approach it carefully.

 

Edler left money on the table to secure his NTC. Trade protection was very important to him. So I don't see him waiving outright unless he's put under enough pressure that the idea of staying in Vancouver starts to become unpalatable. And I don't think going the hardball method would play out well.

 

Perhaps the best approach would be to start (or have already started) making gentle nudges toward Edler moving on. Like telling him the team is rebuilding. Letting him know early on that he won't be re-signed. And trying to get a clear idea of destinations he'd consider for the next stage of his career. Keep it unofficial at first. Don't ask for a waive and list. At least not initially. Just keep it to informal discussions. And eventually get to the point where both parties can work out the details for a trade together. Keep Edler and his agent fully in the loop. Show him the respect he deserves. And be sensitive to his desire to stay here. But also make it clear that his time in Vancouver is coming to a close. Sell him on the idea of choosing his next team and getting an early start on making the move. That kind of approach probably avoids any potential drama. And I do think they should be having those kinds of talks.

 

As for the idea of exposing the Sedins at the expansion draft, that would have required asking both twins to waive their NMCs. I have a hard time imagining that playing out very well. The Sedins are the ultimate team guys but I still think they refuse that request and likely come away highly insulted. It sends a pretty strong message as to how management sees them. But if your goal is seeing the Sedins retire early and possibly leave Vancouver with a sour taste in their mouths, then asking them to waive their NMCs and go into the expansion draft would probably have been a pretty effective approach.

 

Was that the point? Getting the Sedins to retire and clear the way for the next generation? Can't say I'd support that idea. The twins deserve to retire on their own terms. And even though last season was disappointing (all around), I don't think the Sedins are "done" as players or can't be useful as the elder statesmen of this rebuild. And based on everything they've said, they will retire if they feel they can't help the team or are no longer wanted.

 

I don't think they need to be forced out. And I really don't think it's time for that.

 

Or was exposing the twins an actual protection strategy for the expansion draft?

 

If so, just out of curiosity, how would have exposing the Sedins helped us at the expansion draft? Allow us to protect Gaunce and Boucher? It doesn't really open up a spot to protect Sbisa. Whether you go 7 forwards/3 Ds or 8 skaters, it still doesn't change the fact that one of our top-4 non-exempt Ds would have likely needed to have been exposed. Just seems like a lot of bother for very little reward.

 

And really not very respectful of the two greatest Canucks of all time.

 

I dunno. I guess I just don't see the point.

[Warhippy]

So how about that Juolevi