[Signing] Flames sign Jacob Markstrom

[Me_]

1 hour ago, Provost said:

It was a toss up whether we should have signed Markstrom and then gotten some great assets for Demko, or sign Demko and let Markstrom walk to free agency.

 

Honestly, I was fine either way and can’t blame Benning whichever way he went.

I think over the course of their contracts they will be pretty comparable.  You are giving up a couple of peak Markstrom for a hopefully better Demko in a few years.

I’m fine with the way things unfolded.

 

But I would’ve kept Toffoli.

 

Edited November 7, 2021 by Me_

[higgyfan]

44 minutes ago, Me_ said:

I’m fine with the way things unfolded.

 

But I would’ve kept Toffoli.

 

Canucks are a younger team now.  I much prefer Demko (25) and Garland (25) over Marks (31) and Toffoli (29).

That spread of years is in the Canucks favour.

[coryberg]

2 hours ago, Provost said:

I think over the course of their contracts they will be pretty comparable.  You are giving up a couple of peak Markstrom for a hopefully better Demko in a few years.

Markstroms numbers in a vancouver jersey...

2.73GAA .913sv%

Demko's numbers in a vancouver jersey...

2.89GAA .912sv%

 

He's already as good.

 

[Provost]

1 minute ago, coryberg said:

Markstroms numbers in a vancouver jersey...

2.73GAA .913sv%

Demko's numbers in a vancouver jersey...

2.89GAA .912sv%

 

He's already as good.

 

I guess you haven’t been paying attention to the fact Markstrom is likely going to be a Vezina finalist this year?

 

[coryberg]

1 minute ago, Provost said:

I guess you haven’t been paying attention to the fact Markstrom is likely going to be a Vezina finalist this year?

 

Do you think his numbers would be the same on this team?

[McBackup]

5 hours ago, Provost said:

I guess you haven’t been paying attention to the fact Markstrom is likely going to be a Vezina finalist this year?

 

I guess you haven't watched Demko this year at all either.

[Provost]

1 hour ago, McBackup said:

I guess you haven't watched Demko this year at all either.

Yikes, how fragile do you have to be as a fan to not be able to admit a player from another team is playing better even when objective reality shows they are?

 

.942 save %, 1.65 goals against, 4 shutouts in 9 games.

 

vs.

.918 save %, 2.59 goals against, 0 shutouts in 10 games.

 

One gets you Vezina votes… the other one is middle of the pack.

 

 

[McBackup]

9 minutes ago, Provost said:

Yikes, how fragile do you have to be as a fan to not be able to admit a player from another team is playing better even when objective reality shows they are?

 

.942 save %, 1.65 goals against, 4 shutouts in 9 games.

 

vs.

.918 save %, 2.59 goals against, 0 shutouts in 10 games.

 

One gets you Vezina votes… the other one is middle of the pack.

 

 

Ad hominem cope.

[Elias Pettersson]

47 minutes ago, Provost said:

Yikes, how fragile do you have to be as a fan to not be able to admit a player from another team is playing better even when objective reality shows they are?

 

.942 save %, 1.65 goals against, 4 shutouts in 9 games.

 

vs.

.918 save %, 2.59 goals against, 0 shutouts in 10 games.

 

One gets you Vezina votes… the other one is middle of the pack.

 

 

Markstrom and Demko are both playing at an elite level right now.  The difference in their stats is related more to the system that Sutter utilizes in Calgary versus whatever system Green has going in Vancouver.  If you actually watch both of them play you cannot say that Markstrom is actually a better goalie in isolation.

[McBackup]

10 hours ago, Elias Pettersson said:

Markstrom and Demko are both playing at an elite level right now.  The difference in their stats is related more to the system that Sutter utilizes in Calgary versus whatever system Green has going in Vancouver.  If you actually watch both of them play you cannot say that Markstrom is actually a better goalie in isolation.

It's not even whether or not Markstrom is a better goalie right now (I think he is, but Demko isn't that far behind him), it's whether or not you'd rather have a 35 year old Markstrom at 6 mil than a 30 year old Demko at 5 mil, and if you think having Markstrom in net is somehow going to make the team in front of him play better when Demko is already standing on his head to no avail. 

Edited November 8, 2021 by McBackup

[Boudrias]

I can watch the Flames and smile when I see Marky or Tanev make a play. They were great Canucks. That said I don't have a problem that JB moved on. He went younger and had to do that considering the money they would have asked for along with the term. 

 

My biggest issue was that both the left the Canucks for nothing. A Vezina goal tender left for nothing back. That's hard to take. 

[48MPHSlapShot]

On 11/6/2021 at 6:27 PM, *Buzzsaw* said:

The question is not whether Markstrom is a better goalie than Demko... they both are good goalies but Demko is cheaper.

 

The real question is why Benning got nothing in return for Markstrom when he knew 3 years ago he would have to deal him or Demko or lose him to free agency or even the expansion draft.

 

Markstrom had real value as trade bait before the deadline last year or two years ago.

 

It should have been obvious this team was not playoff bound last year, and Markstrom should have been dealt for a pick/prospect.

 

But instead, Benning hung on to him, even though he knew there likely wouldn't be any CAP space for his new contract.

 

That is the real failure... the loss of a good player for nothing.

 

if a GM knows he is going to lose an asset, he should make plans to trade that asset for something which he won't lose.

Lotta hindsight with this post. 3 years ago Marky was just starting to heat up, and we had absolutely no idea what we had in Demko yet. We really didn't have any idea what Demko was capable of until the bubble. It was simply too big of a risk to move Marky at that point, and moving Demko would have meant signing eventually signing Marky to a contract similar to what the Flames gave him. 

 

I'm fine with how things have worked out for us goalie-wise. We have a young, high level starter locked up for the foreseeable

future. 

 

And good for Marky. He was a warrior for us and I hope he gets his Vezina.

 

What I can't forgive is losing Madden and a 2nd for nothing and not resigning Tanev.

Edited November 8, 2021 by 48MPHSlapShot

[wai_lai416]

Lol markstrom playing excellent coz of the system they play in Calgary..  hes a good goalie elevated to great this season behind good coaching. remember the LA kings team? Quick was playing at a vezina caliber when Sutter was there. Coincident certain goalie when moved to a team with great defensive structured coaches all of a sudden puts on vezina like campaign? Carolina regardless of what goalie they put in is playing like a vezina goalie.. mrazek the rookie last year now Anderson. Columbus when torts was there plays great defensive hockey. Islander with trotz. Put demko in Calgary behind the way the flames defense is playing he will be as good if not better. 

 

Also helps when your team don't have a defense philosophy of letting the other team shoot as many perimeter shots as they want. 

[KoreanHockeyFan]

Unless the complaint is about letting Markstrom walk to UFA (which I think is still a bit of a weak argument), then I understand where some of the displeasure is coming from.

 

But if we're still harping on the fact that we kept Demko over Markstrom, y'all are insane.

 

First off, there's no way we were keeping both. Second, Demko's the MVP so far for the Canucks. I think we can all agree that the Canucks defence has been quite trashy so far this season and Demko is the reason as to why the defence hasn't completely collapsed.

 

Demko is also 5 years younger than Markstrom. Based on both goalies' play so far this year, I'm taking Demko for 5 years at $5M per over Markstrom for 6 years at $6M per every time, 10 times out of 10. 

 

There's no way Markstrom has the same stats if he was still playing with the Canucks and our terrible defensive system. 

[KoreanHockeyFan]

9 hours ago, Provost said:

Yikes, how fragile do you have to be as a fan to not be able to admit a player from another team is playing better even when objective reality shows they are?

 

.942 save %, 1.65 goals against, 4 shutouts in 9 games.

 

vs.

.918 save %, 2.59 goals against, 0 shutouts in 10 games.

 

One gets you Vezina votes… the other one is middle of the pack.

 

 

The correlation you make between their stats and their positions in the NHL's goaltending hierarchy is quite weak seeing as how it doesn't account for other contributing factors. E.g. defensive systems and overall play of the rest of the teams.

 

Your correlation only makes sense if you're trying to suggest that the Flames and Canucks defensive play are comparable, which it clearly is not for the season thus far.

[Warhippy]

10 hours ago, Provost said:

Yikes, how fragile do you have to be as a fan to not be able to admit a player from another team is playing better even when objective reality shows they are?

 

.942 save %, 1.65 goals against, 4 shutouts in 9 games.

 

vs.

.918 save %, 2.59 goals against, 0 shutouts in 10 games.

 

One gets you Vezina votes… the other one is middle of the pack.

 

 

OK and?

 

Are we forgetting that the Flames had the ability to trade for 2 former 5th overall picks in Hanifin and Lindholm?  Or that they have one of the top winger pests in the game in Tkachuk?  How about Zadorov?  Tanev?  Rasmus Andersson (our 2nd round pick who I was screaming for in his draft year prior to the trade)

 

They're different teams entirely with different coaches.  People can malign him all they want but Sutter is 10x the coach that Green is.

 

Put Demko on the flames I am willing to be they are comparable in numbers.  Shutouts?  Maybe not but Demko would find it far easier playing in front of a Sutter lead squad than the tire fire Green is presenting here when you factor in coaching and lines.

 

Markstrom is gone, is 10 years older than Demko and we've moved on.

[Timråfan]

1 hour ago, 48MPHSlapShot said:3 years ago Marky was just starting to heat up

Marky has probably been as good since the dats in AHL when he gave Green a push up the ladder. 
The difference is that Marky don’t have players like Pouliot in front.

I was close to say Gudbranson but he thrives with their defensive structure as well. 

[JM_]

I wish him the best personally,  but Marky will always be a bit of a traitor to me for going to the F'Lames and taking Tanev with him. Just being honest. 

[joe-max]

4 hours ago, Boudrias said:

My biggest issue was that both the left the Canucks for nothing. A Vezina goal tender left for nothing back. That's hard to take. 

You are aware the the actual Vezina winner from last year was traded for (basically) nothing?

[Tower102]

On 11/6/2021 at 6:27 PM, *Buzzsaw* said:

The question is not whether Markstrom is a better goalie than Demko... they both are good goalies but Demko is cheaper.

 

The real question is why Benning got nothing in return for Markstrom when he knew 3 years ago he would have to deal him or Demko or lose him to free agency or even the expansion draft.

 

Markstrom had real value as trade bait before the deadline last year or two years ago.

 

It should have been obvious this team was not playoff bound last year, and Markstrom should have been dealt for a pick/prospect.

 

But instead, Benning hung on to him, even though he knew there likely wouldn't be any CAP space for his new contract.

 

That is the real failure... the loss of a good player for nothing.

 

if a GM knows he is going to lose an asset, he should make plans to trade that asset for something which he won't lose.

Markstrom was gone by last year, and injured in his last year under contract. 

 

Why do Canuck fans pretend we are the only team that ever loses players to free agency.