The time has come!

[YEGCanuck]

When will we see a woman on the Canucks coaching and/or management staff? This question came to mind given todays announcement of Kim Ng as the new GM of MLB's Miami Marlins.

 

Can a woman compete for such a position in Vancouver? Will a woman be compensated fairly for comparable value? Are they capable or is hockey a male domain only? When will the Anguilini's lead the way?

 

Thinking it is time for a rational conversation.  What do you think?  

[BoKnows]

Epic

[Nuxfanabroad]

VGTOW?!

[goalie13]

It's hard to predict when, but I think it will happen one day soon.

 

Cammi Granato is a pro scout for Seattle.  She seems like the type that could be behind the bench in the not-so-distant future.  Seattle seems like the progressive type of organization that would make this move first.

[Phil_314]

Is it more of a speaking point for "progressiveness" or is it more out of necessity?

 

• we have one of the best head coaches in Green
• we have a solid scouting GM in Benning (maybe a more rational female trading co-GM?)
• If there's a female scouting Guru to replace Brackett I'd gladly welcome her hiring
• alternatively if they could find some mentoring role for a Hayley Wickenheiser then that'd be great 

[-SN-]

Gender diversity in NHL front office:

 

 

It might be a while. 

[King Heffy]

1 hour ago, YEGCanuck said:

Can a woman compete for such a position in Vancouver? Will a woman be compensated fairly for comparable value? Are they capable or is hockey a male domain only? When will the Anguilini's lead the way?

I thought they were going to allow the Maple Leafs to participate in a men's league this year.

[-AJ-]

I'm not sure I see women in head coaching jobs any time soon, but I could see a management position for one pretty soon. I could also see them having coaches in positional roles or as advisors.

[Rubik]

9 hours ago, StealthNuck said:

Gender diversity in NHL front office:

 

 

It might be a while. 

Not trying to be politically incorrect, but what's the point of including non-binary, gf etc. if they don't even appear on the chart? I guess one could say they feel included this way at least, but if you think about it isn't their lack of presence just more jarring this way?

 

I'm all for every kinds of people and ofc we shouldn't marginalize anybody, but in this case that just doesn't make any sense to me. I know it wasn't you who made the chart and I'm not asking you in particular, I'm just genuinely curious what others think. (and also not that it's like the biggest problem ever, it just really got me thinking)

 

But staying on topic, I guess the NHL has to decide whether it wants to be a male-only league going forward or not. I don't think there would be any problem with a male-only league, but if I remember correctly the league already had a female backup goaltender at some point during the 90s so that kinda tells us where they stand on the issue. So based on that, I think they shouldn't be concerned about whether the applicant for a coach/GM role is a male, female or non-binary etc.; the one who's the best fit for the job should get the position.

 

While I can see why having female skaters could be a problem, I don't see any reason why a woman couldn't be a GM; that's all about brain and building a winning team and obviously no one's gonna say that men are smarter than women.

Edited November 14, 2020 by Rubik

[Boudrias]

Best person available for the job, man or woman. That said I also have preference for NHL experience in management. At a minimum pro hockey experience. I don't know the women's hockey programs to know how good they might be. I have no interest in hiring based on political correctness.  

[-DLC-]

13 hours ago, YEGCanuck said:

When will we see a woman on the Canucks coaching and/or management staff? This question came to mind given todays announcement of Kim Ng as the new GM of MLB's Miami Marlins.

 

Can a woman compete for such a position in Vancouver? Will a woman be compensated fairly for comparable value? Are they capable or is hockey a male domain only? When will the Anguilini's lead the way?

 

Thinking it is time for a rational conversation.  What do you think?  

I feel like the world is shifting to be more open minded and think outside the box.  Even if it's sometimes having to be dragged there with resistance.

 

I'm with Boudrias...best person for the job.  When the City of Richmond had an issue with sexism they started hiring more women and it moved away from testing physicality, etc. to more of an inclusion based hiring.  That can be a slippery slope.  However, IF a woman proves she can do the job, then she should be treated 100% equal in that role.  Period.  There are some jobs that require a high level of strength and physicality and if that's the basis of "testing" for it, so be it.  May the best man/woman get the job. 

 

Sadly, I don't think women will be compensated fairly for awhile yet...as a woman who's fought hard to "prove" that I'm worth what my male counterparts are, it's been a struggle. 

 

Was passed over for a job when it became official once....after pretty much running the operation with one other colleague (it was a crazy summer where we had all kinds of obstacles to overcome).  Although we'd proven ourselves and pulled things out of the dirt singlehandedly, neither him nor I got the job (he didn't want it...he was happy to just coast for awhile after that strenuous summer).   Despite this, they went on to hire a man in a new role created for him (who let the place go down the tubes).   Operations Manager Sam (not his real name...but one he used on the job) ... who was caught on POF during work hours and whose first meeting I walked out of because his philosophy was "tell the customer yes to everything...anything they want"...even if we knew, full well, that we couldn't do it.  I shifted into a role that had to follow up with these disgruntled customers...so...a big NO from me on that.  There's aftermath and clean up to do when things play out that way.  Short term gratification does not outweigh long term headaches and scars to reputation.  Honesty gave us repeat customers...his way got us plenty of bad reviews and an F rating with the BBB (that I slugged it out to bring back up to a C+...was on a first name basis with BBB staff, who trusted if I said "I'll fix this" that it would happen) and reflected that in our rating.  Again...giving answers rather than excuses).   One customer in particular, whose account Sam had bungled SO badly that I was completely embarrassed when having to follow up with him...I was shocked when months later he returned.  Told me it was because I never ignored his call...even when it got tough, I was there for him and we were the devil he knew (vs going out there and trying again...the industry itself was pretty bad).  Sam NEVER took calls.  Ever.

 

It got so bad that Sam was ruining high profile/prominent customer's accounts (some were NHL players/families, etc.)  That hit me in the heart and soul (and I left not long afterward).  Hell no.   Again....total embarrassment when I had to "answer" for decisions that a bone headed higher up was making.  Who was also making much more than I was.

 

Sam was tall, loud (he thought he was charismatic...I called it nauseating) and, frankly full of......bologna.  But he fit the "look" of someone of strength and they thought that was enough to scare people into doing business with them.   A guy in a suit who was tall and...very quickly exposed himself to be a fraud.  Ignored people and hid in a "nexxxxt" way.

 

Women can prove themselves yet still be passed over because it's a man's world.  Going to take some time to really gain some ground.  The US having a female VP is a huge stride and things like that will move us to where we need to be.  

 

As for this coaching idea.  If a woman is qualified and wants the job, I see no reason why she shouldn't be evaluated on that.  Period.  The doors are slowly opening for that to become a thing.....

[falcon45ca]

One of the best things about sports is that, by and large, it's a pure meritocracy.

 

 

If a lady could dunk like LeBron & hit 3's like Curry, she'd be in the NBA.

 

 

Likewise, Kim Ng has succeeded at the highest level in MLB, and has shown she's capable of success at the MLB level.

 

 

Hiring diversity for the sake of diversity tho? That's for the birds, and the 1st team that hires based on diversity instead of merit will be the 1st team in last place.

Edited November 14, 2020 by falcon45ca

[TheRocket18]

Meritocracy (merit, from Latin mereō, and -cracy, from Ancient Greek κράτος kratos 'strength, power') is a political system in which economic goods and/or political power are vested in individual people on the basis of talent, effort, and achievement, rather than wealth or social class.^[1] Advancement in such a system is based on performance, as measured through examination or demonstrated achievement. Although the concept of meritocracy has existed for centuries, the term itself was coined in 1958 by the sociologist Michael Dunlop Young in his satirical essay The Rise of the Meritocracy.^[2]

 

^{nice vocab Falcon!}

[Lancaster]

I personally can care less if it's a woman or not.  I just want the best person for the job.... whether it's some white dude from the Prairies, some woman from Djibouti, or some random whatever from Xenu.  Just get whoever will get results and win us the Stanley Cup.  

[McBackup]

I'm in favour of hiring a woman if she's the best person for the job.

 

I'm not in favour of hiring a woman simply because she has a vagina and it lets you signal how progressive you are for social brownie points.

Edited November 15, 2020 by Bitter Melon

[CaptKirk888]

13 hours ago, Rubik said:

But staying on topic, I guess the NHL has to decide whether it wants to be a male-only league going forward or not. I don't think there would be any problem with a male-only league, but if I remember correctly the league already had a female backup goaltender at some point during the 90s so that kinda tells us where they stand on the issue. So based on that, I think they shouldn't be concerned about whether the applicant for a coach/GM role is a male, female or non-binary etc.; the one who's the best fit for the job should get the position.

 

While I can see why having female skaters could be a problem, I don't see any reason why a woman couldn't be a GM; that's all about brain and building a winning team and obviously no one's gonna say that men are smarter than women.

That was basically a publicity stunt by Phil Esposito when Tampa Bay entered the league in 92. She played one period in an exhibition game. 

 

https://www.thecanadianencyclopedia.ca/en/article/manon-rheaume

 

First Woman to Play in NHL

In the summer of 1992, following Rhéaume’s gold-medal win at the IIHF Women’s World Championships, Phil Esposito of the Tampa Bay Lightning invited her to attend training camp as one of eight goaltenders trying out for the team. The Lightning was a new NHL expansion team in a non-traditional hockey market, so the whole tryout was widely viewed as little more than a publicity stunt.

Yet Rhéaume survived the first round of cuts, and was given the first period of a pre-season exhibition match against the St. Louis Blues. She allowed two goals on nine shots, becoming the first woman to play in a National Hockey League game. She also became the first woman to appear in any of North America’s major professional sports leagues.

The appearance led to significant publicity, including many international media requests. She appeared on Late Night with David Letterman, and was offered $50,000 for an interview and photo shoot with Playboy (which she turned down).

[goalie13]

8 hours ago, Boudrias said:

Best person available for the job, man or woman. That said I also have preference for NHL experience in management. At a minimum pro hockey experience. I don't know the women's hockey programs to know how good they might be. I have no interest in hiring based on political correctness.  

So you never would have hired Pat Burns?  Tom Renney?  Mike Babcock?  Jon Cooper?  Ken Hitchcock?  Bob Hartley?  Scotty Bowman?  Lou Lamoriello?

[J.I.A.H.N]

Well, at first I was going to make a joke.........but the question should make us all think

There is absolutely no reason why a woman could not coach a team, if she had the credentials to coach it.

It pretty much sucks, that we even have to ask the question

 

I have a son and a daughter, and as they were growing up, sure there were times that I did not ask her to do things, because she was too small

But, I can honestly say, I always told her, she could do and be what ever she set her mind to, at least as well as a man.

 

Never set limits, only expectations!

[J.I.A.H.N]

7 minutes ago, janisahockeynut said:

Well, at first I was going to make a joke.........but the question should make us all think

There is absolutely no reason why a woman could not coach a team, if she had the credentials to coach it.

It pretty much sucks, that we even have to ask the question

 

I have a son and a daughter, and as they were growing up, sure there were times that I did not ask her to do things, because she was too small

But, I can honestly say, I always told her, she could do and be what ever she set her mind to, at least as well as a man.

 

Never set limits, only expectations!

To quote myself

There is absolutely no reason why a woman could not coach a team, if she had the credentials to coach it.

Woman's hockey has come a long ways in 20 years.

The Women athlete's now play at an incredible standard at the highest levels

and are taught the very same lessens, and skills

Including skill development, nutrition, advanced defensive play tactics, advanced offensive play tactics, etc.............

In some ways the question is....can a woman be as smart as a man?

Usually smarter! With some of the dumber things I have done! 

For us older guys, alot of us have not worked directly for a woman............but with you younger people, it is starting to happen more and more

Society is changing, but slooooowly! 

It will happen.....when? I am not about to try to say when..........

[lmm]

https://www.ctvnews.ca/sports/raptors-president-proud-to-see-women-playing-big-role-in-team-s-success-1.4778775

 

I love this guy, and the way he thinks

 

Maybe some day the Canucks will be as forward thinking as the Raps

 

It won't be soon, but it won't be soon enough either