Nikita Tryamkin | D

[CanadianRugby]

2 minutes ago, Rob_Zepp said:

You know a guy.....well, that settles it.

Was responding to a guy that said the exact same thing and said take it for what it's worth.  I think the Sedin/Coach/GM comments settle it.  

2 minutes ago, Rob_Zepp said:

The other stuff you post is fine....he responded and that is what young guys are expected to do.   He didn't quit.   He didn't give up.   He put his head down, when to AHL and is now on verge of blossoming as a key power forward in the NHL....and perhaps its fastest.    

 

Tell me how that is the same as what Tryamkin did?

Did he respond though?  He's slightly improved (not on the stat sheet but away from the puck he did).  

He's been on the verge of blossoming into a key power forward in the NHL since he got drafted.  Let's see if he can turn into a decent 3rd liner before we call him a key power forward.  

 

Tell me how I said Tryamkin did something that Virtanen did?  

[D.B Cooper]

56 minutes ago, CanadianRugby said:

The ones I been hearing. 

The evidence I been seeing. 

I call BS. 

10 minutes ago, CanadianRugby said:

In the interview done in Russia after he left he said it was due to ice time.  

 

I also have met a number of people, well one person, that's worked with him and said he has a bad attitude and is an all around jerk.  Take that for what it's worth.

 

Daniel Sedin & the coach calling him lazy:

He was among a group of players Daniel Sedin recently, and uncharacteristically, called out publicly for, essentially, not trying often enough.

He had his minutes choked by his head coach for “mistakes,” which may have been on the ice, off of it or both.

https://nationalpost.com/sports/hockey/nhl/vancouver-canucks-giving-suspended-jake-virtanen-some-tough-love

 

Benning questioning his habits:

“The problem with Jake is he’s never had any adversity in his career,”

“He’s always been able to sail along on his talent.  This is a wake-up call. He’s learning how to be a pro and that’s in the weight room, his nutrition and his workouts. With him it’s about his habits, his day-to-day habits. He’s taking ownership of that.”

 

If the coach, GM and the Sedins of all people are calling you out, there's probably something there.  He's young and can change, maybe he already has.  Though the only reason people are denying there are issues with Virtanen is because he's a Canuck.  With his size/speed/shot/physicality he should be doing better than he has. 

This has nothing to do with being a jerk or having a bad attitude.  

Seeing as this was a couple years ago, it is pretty obvious this was about him learning how much effort he has to put in to being a pro.  

 

You are are making up your own story with snippets of info.  

[CanadianRugby]

Just now, drummerboy said:

I call BS. 

This has nothing to do with being a jerk or having a bad attitude.  

Seeing as this was a couple years ago, it is pretty obvious this was about him learning how much effort he has to put in to being a pro.  

 

You are are making up your own story with snippets of info.  

If laziness isn't a bad attitude then there is no bad attitude.  

[aGENT]

16 minutes ago, CanadianRugby said:

In the interview done in Russia after he left he said it was due to ice time.  

 

I also have met a number of people, well one person, that's worked with him and said he has a bad attitude and is an all around jerk.  Take that for what it's worth.

 

Daniel Sedin & the coach calling him lazy:

He was among a group of players Daniel Sedin recently, and uncharacteristically, called out publicly for, essentially, not trying often enough.

He had his minutes choked by his head coach for “mistakes,” which may have been on the ice, off of it or both.

https://nationalpost.com/sports/hockey/nhl/vancouver-canucks-giving-suspended-jake-virtanen-some-tough-love

 

Benning questioning his habits:

“The problem with Jake is he’s never had any adversity in his career,”

“He’s always been able to sail along on his talent.  This is a wake-up call. He’s learning how to be a pro and that’s in the weight room, his nutrition and his workouts. With him it’s about his habits, his day-to-day habits. He’s taking ownership of that.”

 

If the coach, GM and the Sedins of all people are calling you out, there's probably something there.  He's young and can change, maybe he already has.  Though the only reason people are denying there are issues with Virtanen is because he's a Canuck.  With his size/speed/shot/physicality he should be doing better than he has. 

More of a maturity issue than what you claimed FWIW. An issue he went a long way towards rectifying this past ~year'ish.

[Rob_Zepp]

3 minutes ago, CanadianRugby said:

Was responding to a guy that said the exact same thing and said take it for what it's worth.  I think the Sedin/Coach/GM comments settle it.  

Did he respond though?  He's slightly improved (not on the stat sheet but away from the puck he did).  

He's been on the verge of blossoming into a key power forward in the NHL since he got drafted.  Let's see if he can turn into a decent 3rd liner before we call him a key power forward.  

 

Tell me how I said Tryamkin did something that Virtanen did?  

If you don't think Virtanen has improved by leaps and bounds, you are simply confirming you don't really follow the team and/or willfully ignore this player.

 

You invoked Virtanen in the Trymakin thread, if you did that just to take yet another of our endless swipes at Virtanen versus actually trying to make a point about Tryamkin in the Tryamkin thread and you used Tryamkin in your post, I apologize for assuming.   

[alfstonker]

5 hours ago, Rob_Zepp said:

I have said many times I was not keen on WD as the Canucks coach.   I just don't see how you are linking the issues.    I don't view Tryamkin not being in Vancouver having anything to do with WD IF he is a player you want on a team.    I did and still do like the concept of him as a player - always have - as long as he doesn't have an attitude that would mean quitting if he doesn't like the coaching.   No team needs a player like that.

 

I don't understand how you can relate the two issues or not understand how having a player that would quit for the reasons you are implying is not a player you would want.

Because he has a thorn in his butt about WD. What other explanation can there be.

Like you Robb, I would love to see a fit and motivated Tryamkin back in a Canucks jersey but somehow I don't see it.

[Tre Mac]

Quote

"Sometimes I read the forum of fans on internet.  In my thread they always arguing, why? I thought they lived in dopecity, always happy?  I don't get it.  Maybe when I return to dopecity to play hockey they will stop arguing no?"

Tryamkin on his thread on CDC, crica 2018.

Edited July 19, 2018 by Tre Mac

[SilentSam]

13 hours ago, alfstonker said:

Ah the straw man argument has surfaced when finally facing reality.

 

This has nothing to do with the coach and everything to do with your obsession with the player, the coach and the player's own immaturity. Lidster was the D coach and as I have said Lidster would ultimately decide TOI, shift changes etc. WD would become involved when he felt that Tryamkin could do more to fulfil his potential and to help the team.

 

It is strange how Hutton, a player who has had his TOI reduced and had to suffer healthy scratches on many an occasion has not had the same type of feverish ranting on his behalf. Is it because Hutton has taken it like a man and realised the coach has only the best intentions at heart for the player? Or is it that Hutton doesn't knock people on their backside and cream them into the boards. I suspect the latter.

 

At the end of the day people like you have to face reality.

 

1. WD believed not in what Tryamkin was but what he could be.

2. Whether WD allocated minutes or Lidster did, it came down to the same thing. Young players had to work for what they got. That is the only way to be fair to the other young players who were prepared to work (Bo, Stetch) to vary their game (Baertschi Gaunce) 

3. If Tryamkin wanted more minutes he needed to firstly realise that the coach runs the team, that he needed to abandon this "victim attitude" and appreciate that none of the coaches were trying to destroy him or ask him to do something he couldn't do, just to do it more consistently. 

4. He was NEVER asked to fight. That is a myth put about by "the butthurt"

5. Physicality is a state of mind, where it is a player's particular attribute, it needs to be deployed from the minute the player steps on the ice until he steps off it. That is what Chara does, Pronger, Byfuglien, Webber, Opik etc.

 

WD was never against young players he was for making them work and improve themselves to justify being in the team. WD was not a great NHL coach (he did however take an ordinary team to 101 points the 5th highest Canucks total in the last 16years) but he did have a great CV and reputation for improving players and bringing out their potential. He understood that few young players, if any get very far in the game unless they understand and carry out their defensive responsibilities. Poor defense not only hurts the team but affects the performance of your team mates. That is why WD was hard on some players and most saw the light and elevated their game on the back of it.

 

 

Your Love for Desjardins is astounding and noted.

I could care less about someone (Desjardins) who has no ties to this organization anymore, and his tenure here only got worse,  a negative.

We still have the rights to Tryamkin, that, in its possibilities, is positive.. but I’m sure you, in all your infinite wisdom, will keep trying to spin that.

You and Zepp feel he is a bad apple, or is egocentrically privledged.. don’t want him, but do want him.

Why not concentrate on the positive that exists, than the negative that does not exist anymore.

Willie who?

 

Edited July 19, 2018 by SilentSam

[Kanukfanatic]

Holy schnikey!!  That is alot of chatter about a russian 3rd pairing D the Canucks have under contract but bolted back home. I liked Tryamkin when he was here.

 

He has some traits few NHL players do...namely his behemoth size and strength. He is average on D but young and can get better. 

 

I hope his attitude changes and he comes back but if he doesn't...well....whatever.  Certainly not a make or break for the Nucks.

[VegasCanuck]

1 hour ago, Kanukfanatic said:

Holy schnikey!!  That is alot of chatter about a russian 3rd pairing D the Canucks have under contract but bolted back home. I liked Tryamkin when he was here.

 

He has some traits few NHL players do...namely his behemoth size and strength. He is average on D but young and can get better. 

 

I hope his attitude changes and he comes back but if he doesn't...well....whatever.  Certainly not a make or break for the Nucks.

I think the same thing. He showed signs of being able to really elevate his game, but he needed to work with coaching and continue to adjust and fine tune his game for the NHL. My concern is that he jumped back to an inferior league at the wrong point in his development and could very well wind up becoming no better than a 7th D in the NHL.

 

Time will tell. Hope he still develops and comes back, but we've seen lots of guys from the KHL try and make the jump to the NHL past 25 years old and many have not been able to make the jump. 20 - 25 is when certain principles of being a pro at the NHL level and being able to maintain pace for 82 game schedule, plus playoffs, get driven home. Its a process that we are going through right now with Virtanen.

 

I see this whole situation as, Tryamkin took the easy approach instead of pushing himself from being a pretty good D towards becoming and exceptional D.

[alfstonker]

12 hours ago, SilentSam said:

Your Love for Desjardins is astounding and noted.

I could care less about someone (Desjardins) who has no ties to this organization anymore, and his tenure here only got worse,  a negative.

We still have the rights to Tryamkin, that, in its possibilities, is positive.. but I’m sure you, in all your infinite wisdom, will keep trying to spin that.

You and Zepp feel he is a bad apple, or is egocentrically privledged.. don’t want him, but do want him.

Why not concentrate on the positive that exists, than the negative that does not exist anymore.

Willie who?

 

For someone who couldn't care less, your mentioning of WD goes on.....and on.......and on......and on........You are frankly beginning to embarrass yourself with it now. 

 

I have never said Tryamkin was a "bad apple" (as for Robb how many times does he have to deny it?) Jeez what is it with you zealots that you have to mis-quote anyone who is not filled with your Kool-aid as having a down on him. 

 

"Like you Rob, I would love to see a fit and motivated Tryamkin back in a Canucks jersey but somehow I don't see it."

 

WTF does that say I think he is a bad apple. If I thought that I wouldn't want him back. You know me well enough to know that's true. If I didn't like a player I wouldn't want him here.

 

I'm not keen on his maturity level, I'm not keen on his apparent self entitlement, I'm not very keen on his apparent refusal to follow coach's instructions - BUT that doesn't make him a "bad apple" 

 

As for "positives" and this is where you need to calm down, there are NO positives as long as he is over there and not in a Canuck jersey.

 

 

Edited July 20, 2018 by alfstonker

[Boudrias]

2 hours ago, alfstonker said:

For someone who couldn't care less, your mentioning of WD goes on.....and on.......and on......and on........You are frankly beginning to embarrass yourself with it now. 

 

I have never said Tryamkin was a "bad apple" (as for Robb how many times does he have to deny it?) Jeez what is it with you zealots that you have to mis-quote anyone who is not filled with your Kool-aid as having a down on him. 

 

"Like you Rob, I would love to see a fit and motivated Tryamkin back in a Canucks jersey but somehow I don't see it."

 

WTF does that say I think he is a bad apple. If I thought that I wouldn't want him back. You know me well enough to know that's true. If I didn't like a player I wouldn't want him here.

 

I'm not keen on his maturity level, I'm not keen on his apparent self entitlement, I'm not very keen on his apparent refusal to follow coach's instructions - BUT that doesn't make him a "bad apple" 

 

As for "positives" and this is where you need to calm down, there are NO positives as long as he is over there and not in a Canuck jersey.

 

 

Tryamkin going back to the KHL for the 3 years in his current contract is a huge negative in my mind. KHL hockey is no where close to the NHL and his development will take a big hit. His biggest challenge was his d-zone play IMHO. The longer he spends in the KHL the higher the odds he will not be a NHL player of consequence. 

[elvis15]

16 hours ago, SilentSam said:

Your Love for Desjardins is astounding and noted.

I could care less about someone (Desjardins) who has no ties to this organization anymore, and his tenure here only got worse,  a negative.

We still have the rights to Tryamkin, that, in its possibilities, is positive.. but I’m sure you, in all your infinite wisdom, will keep trying to spin that.

You and Zepp feel he is a bad apple, or is egocentrically privledged.. don’t want him, but do want him.

Why not concentrate on the positive that exists, than the negative that does not exist anymore.

Willie who?

You don't want us to blame Tryamkin for anything because he might return but it's cool to go overboard on a coach we fired because he isn't coming back? That's some weird logic. By all means, if that helps you sleep at night, go ahead, but no need to carry on that narrative here when we've all said Desjardins wasn't the worst coach ever but he wasn't getting it done here so it's fine he's gone.

 

It's also fine Tryamkin's gone if he left even after his ice time was building throughout the season and the coach he apparently wasn't liking was fired to make room for a new one. When he's ready to try again he'll be better for it, but he wasn't ready to stay his first go round.

[vannuck59]

44 minutes ago, Boudrias said:

Tryamkin going back to the KHL for the 3 years in his current contract is a huge negative in my mind. KHL hockey is no where close to the NHL and his development will take a big hit. His biggest challenge was his d-zone play IMHO. The longer he spends in the KHL the higher the odds he will not be a NHL player of consequence. 

 agree , Tryamkin  made up his mind and its his loss. Benning will have to learn how to read the tea leaves. The more I see of Benning the more I believe he is a weak GM. Trade this Kids rights to Washington or Tampa I guarantee that he would have been fine playing 17 minutes with those teams  Get a center prospect or draft pick in return. Move on . 

Edited July 20, 2018 by vannuck59

[Rob_Zepp]

18 minutes ago, vannuck59 said:

The more I see of Benning the more I believe he is a weak GM. 

  Uh, what?!

[Wanless]

4 minutes ago, Rob_Zepp said:

  Uh, what?!

Don’t get caught up with impatience 

[Rob_Zepp]

1 minute ago, Wanless said:

Don’t get caught up with impatience 

Is that was that was?   It seemed like an odd thing to say in the middle of a discussion....super random and without any indication where that came from.   

[Wanless]

Just now, Rob_Zepp said:

Is that was that was?   It seemed like an odd thing to say in the middle of a discussion....super random and without any indication where that came from.   

I think so...

 

 

[vannuck59]

3 minutes ago, Rob_Zepp said:

  Uh, what?!

Good at Drafting ( with help ) but unable to manage the team and make hard decisions. Unable to make the big trade , Paralyzed with the fear of doing or not doing. ( making moves)Trading picks for project players  just a few . Scouting yes, managing no . A good Gm would have seen Tryamkin  fiasco coming a mile away and would have headed it off.

[Rob_Zepp]

7 minutes ago, vannuck59 said:

Good at Drafting ( with help ) but unable to manage the team and make hard decisions. Unable to make the big trade , Paralyzed with the fear of doing or not doing. ( making moves)Trading picks for project players  just a few . Scouting yes, managing no . A good Gm would have seen Tryamkin  fiasco coming a mile away and would have headed it off.

Uh, what big trade didn't he make you were sure was there and he was "afraid of"??    A good GM would know a kid would run home when things got tough before drafting him in the third round?    

Wow, you have impressive insights AND expectations of your GM.    Will be very interested to know what trade(s) he was "scared" of making and how he should have done more homework on Tryamkin's state of mind before drafting him.