Former player accuses Flames head coach Bill Peters of using racial slur -- Peters resigns

[Alflives]

3 minutes ago, mll said:

From Seravelli's article:  "Aliu said Rockford team captain Jake Dowell later confronted Peters about the incident in the coach’s office. Dowell declined to comment, but said he would cooperate in any investigation conducted by the NHL or the Flames." 

 

 

Thanks.  That’s good his captain stood up for him.  Usually captains are stand up guys.  Dowell will tell the NHL and the Flames what happened.  

[Squamfan]

30 minutes ago, timberz21 said:

10 YEARS AGO!  Pretty sure the N word has been a no go for way way longer than that.  We're not talking about 1950 vs 2019....it's 2009 vs 2019.  

 

In 2011, Philadelphia forward Wayne Simmonds had a banana thrown at him during a preseason game in London, Ontario.

In 2012, then-Washington forward Joel Ward was the subject of racist social media posts after he scored a game-winning playoff goal.

In 2014, then-Montreal defenseman P.K. Subban was the subject of racist social media posts after he scored a game-winning playoff goal.

 

Btw, your he said he said, as now been corroborated by at least 2 former teammates of Aliu, go read Fran Seravelli's articles on TSN.

happened against boston in boston the most racsit place in the world

hey guys wanna help me for a couple of grand?

[Maginator]

3 minutes ago, mll said:

From Seravelli's article:  "Aliu said Rockford team captain Jake Dowell later confronted Peters about the incident in the coach’s office. Dowell declined to comment, but said he would cooperate in any investigation conducted by the NHL or the Flames." 

 

 

Guys like this are true beauties. &%$# being a bystander. Especially in the toxic environment of hockey dressing rooms.

I played junior and witnessed tons of hazing. On one particular road trip the "rookie b*$@#'s" were crammed into the bathroom of a bus on a road trip. They all had to strip naked and "run through the gauntlet" of leather belts to the front of the bus.

So glad I refused to degrade myself to that level. Its F#&$ed up because coaches were at the front of the bus, and were well aware of what was going on. The coaches son was one of the belt whippers.

Really no one to inform at the time. Either stay silent and keep playing hockey, or speak out and get outed in small town Alberta.

[RonMexico]

Is it really a fire-able offence? Sure the guy may be a racist jerk but does a comment from 10 years ago mean he should be relived from his post now? Maybe if it comes out that this a long string of being a mean dude but how Steve Downie treated Aliu is way worse than name calling. Though to be fair, psychological abuse is still abuse. Should Steve Downie lose his current job, whatever it is atm, for his actions and treatment of Aliu?

[Down by the River]

8 minutes ago, RonMexico said:

Is it really a fire-able offence? Sure the guy may be a racist jerk but does a comment from 10 years ago mean he should be relived from his post now? Maybe if it comes out that this a long string of being a mean dude but how Steve Downie treated Aliu is way worse than name calling. Though to be fair, psychological abuse is still abuse. Should Steve Downie lose his current job, whatever it is atm, for his actions and treatment of Aliu?

People love taking things away from people that have done wrong. In the end, I'm not sure that this approach helps people change or give back to the people they harmed. I would much rather see Peters put on an extremely short leash and then offered a choice: get fired or start making up for your mistake. Do community work, donate to a charity, apologize to Aliu, etc. I think this would be far more effective that just firing him. 

[Podz92]

7 minutes ago, RonMexico said:

Is it really a fire-able offence? Sure the guy may be a racist jerk but does a comment from 10 years ago mean he should be relived from his post now? Maybe if it comes out that this a long string of being a mean dude but how Steve Downie treated Aliu is way worse than name calling. Though to be fair, psychological abuse is still abuse. Should Steve Downie lose his current job, whatever it is atm, for his actions and treatment of Aliu?

Well this may just be an out for Calgary as the Flames have not been playing well...it's been a rumor for awhile that he was getting turfed...

[captainhorvat]

Rip Bill Peters coaching career. Never liked looking at his sour face dude looks like hes constantly sucking on a lemon.

[KoreanHockeyFan]

46 minutes ago, smokes said:

Drummed up the courage? When someone is racist towards you, the courage comes out at that time more than anything because of the anger that is coursing through your body not ten years later. And why is Babcock even dragged into this. He was a jerk of a coach not a racist.

 

Good examples of things that happened and got dealt with within the same time frame. Not something that was revisited ten years aftern the fact. The league has gotten better on this over the years that that is because when things like tahat happened, Simmonds, Ward and Subban said something about it at the time. Not wait ten years.

Please don't cherry pick in your rebuttal, there's a whole other half in my original post that you should address, but I'll reword it below within the context of your post above.

 

Akim was probably logically thinking about the impact speaking up could have on the beginnings of his professional hockey career, AKA, he was considering the risks on his career. You can't just assume that he would have spoken up instantly.  Like I said, hockey culture prompts him to keep his mouth shut AND there's his entire career on the line for him. That's why I used the Kaerpnick and Babcock analogies. My purpose to "drag" Babcock into this was to display the similar lines of thinking that Marner and Akim were both probably considering when encountering their respective situations. Marner himself didn't bring up the incident cause he doesn't want to risk jeopardizing his career, same thing goes with Akim, but he has chosen to speak up now because he's in a different stage of his career, he's no longer "breaking into the league" - far from it in fact. My comparison is more nuanced than just calling Babcock a "racist" which I clearly was not doing.

 

The examples you posted don't involve a coach, GM, etc - a person in power. The secondary issue here has to do with power dynamics. There's a huge difference between a member of the general public calling you racist things from the stands and your own coach calling you racist things: power dynamics. Peters is Akim's superior. Peters, as Akim's coach, can have an impact on his career. A person from the stands does not (or very minimal at the least). 

Edited November 26, 2019 by KoreanHockeyFan

[Down by the River]

56 minutes ago, smokes said:

See that is racist in itself. People here are free. If they are not free, how do so many allowed to leave the country?

Lol. Talk about propaganda. Being allowed to leave is a very meek definition of free. 

 

I have to wonder if all the people upset that people are being called to the carpet for things they said ten years ago are just people that have a history of saying racist $&!# and want to deter the people they know from mentioning it again. 

 

 

[Down by the River]

46 minutes ago, smokes said:

Drummed up the courage? When someone is racist towards you, the courage comes out at that time more than anything because of the anger that is coursing through your body not ten years later. And why is Babcock even dragged into this. He was a jerk of a coach not a racist.

 

Good examples of things that happened and got dealt with within the same time frame. Not something that was revisited ten years aftern the fact. The league has gotten better on this over the years that that is because when things like tahat happened, Simmonds, Ward and Subban said something about it at the time. Not wait ten years.

A banana being thrown on the ice and fans getting caught for saying things on social media are a lot more noticeable than what a coach says in the room. Hockey has established a culture of "what happens in the room, stays in the room". In some cases, this is a good motto to have... but every so often a case like this comes around where the motto does more harm than good. If you don't understand why players are reluctant to go public with things that happened between coach and player in the room, then you probably haven't played a team sport of any kind. If you have, then you're even dumber for not understanding why this played out the way it did. 

[timberz21]

27 minutes ago, Squamfan said:

happened against boston in boston the most racsit place in the world

hey guys wanna help me for a couple of grand?

My point was, he said we couldn't judge Peters because it happened in another era when it wasn't a big deal.  Was trying to show him that it happended frequently in the past 10+ years and that it didn't happen in the 1950s.

[KoreanHockeyFan]

Just now, Down by the River said:

A banana being thrown on the ice and fans getting caught for saying things on social media are a lot more noticeable than what a coach says in the room. Hockey has established a culture of "what happens in the room, stays in the room". In some cases, this is a good motto to have... but every so often a case like this comes around where the motto does more harm than good. If you don't understand why players are reluctant to go public with things that happened between coach and player in the room, then you probably haven't played a team sport of any kind. If you have, then you're even dumber for not understanding why this played out the way it did. 

Exactly. 

 

I'd be a lot more happy to lash out at a stranger who calls me a gook. My boss? I'd probably talk back, but I'd probably think a little more strategically first to make sure my job isn't negatively impacted.

 

Two completely different situations. 

[Nucker 67]

What he said 10 years ago in the AHL was obviously wrong, but a lot of time has passed and wouldn't this be more of a slanderous statement towards Peters?. Akim waited too long to complain and now he wants to tarnish Peters' reputation? BTW, he sucks as a coach. Glad he's not ours.

 

[rekker]

Dead Man walking. 

[riffraff]

1 hour ago, smokes said:

Not much of a career.

 

He got traded the next year. Why didn't he say anything at that time?

He was a young player at the time so calling out his coach then could have sent him packing unfortunately 

[Hogs & Podz]

41 minutes ago, smokes said:

My point is if Peters was still the person he was ten years ago then there would be more people talking about things happening recently but no one said anything about him for the last ten years so maybe he changed and why judge him as a man now for something said ten years ago?

If you come from a people of color you wouldn't even be asking this question. Every person of color has had to deal with overt racism and even more prevalent, subtle less apparent racial prejudices at some point or in most cases a number of times in their life.  I being one.  I have many examples.  It is still a systemic problem in our current society now... And this example (Peters) is one of many more that will continue to come to light going forward.  

The question of why we haven't heard about this Peters story before now is the exact reason that I just highlighted.  

[timberz21]

50 minutes ago, smokes said:

Drummed up the courage? When someone is racist towards you, the courage comes out at that time more than anything because of the anger that is coursing through your body not ten years later. And why is Babcock even dragged into this. He was a jerk of a coach not a racist.

 

Good examples of things that happened and got dealt with within the same time frame. Not something that was revisited ten years aftern the fact. The league has gotten better on this over the years that that is because when things like tahat happened, Simmonds, Ward and Subban said something about it at the time. Not wait ten years.

Easy to talk about courage behind a keyboard.  Not everybody deals with abuse, racism, violence, etc. the same way.  Some people stand up rightaway, others shut up and put up until they can't no more.     Some people stand up but are rejected because the abuser is so powerful that he can get away with it (i.e. Weinstein), deterring other victims from speaking up.  

 

That wasn't the point of my argument, but ok?!?  My point was to show you that the PEters incident didn't happen in another era, it happened recently with many similar examples.  You seemed to think it happending in the 1950s.  Every case is handle differently, there is not an universal rule.  But clearly, your message to victims is speak now or forever hold your peace, and let your abuser/agressor/etc. get away with it.

[cuporbust]

14 hours ago, #Canucks said:

Seems like a nobody looking to get 5 minutes of the spotlight.

 

14 hours ago, Squamfan said:

Again why is he bringing this issue up know not when it happened. Dude was a plug who could not make it in the NHL and now is seeking attention to be relevant again.

[stawns]

38 minutes ago, Maginator said:

Guys like this are true beauties. &%$# being a bystander. Especially in the toxic environment of hockey dressing rooms.

I played junior and witnessed tons of hazing. On one particular road trip the "rookie b*$@#'s" were crammed into the bathroom of a bus on a road trip. They all had to strip naked and "run through the gauntlet" of leather belts to the front of the bus.

So glad I refused to degrade myself to that level. Its F#&$ed up because coaches were at the front of the bus, and were well aware of what was going on. The coaches son was one of the belt whippers.

Really no one to inform at the time. Either stay silent and keep playing hockey, or speak out and get outed in small town Alberta.

Happened on my bus too, and I refused to participate

[Down by the River]

8 minutes ago, NUCKER67 said:

What he said 10 years ago in the AHL was obviously wrong, but a lot of time has passed and wouldn't this be more of a slanderous statement towards Peters?. Akim waited too long to complain and now he wants to tarnish Peters' reputation? BTW, he sucks as a coach. Glad he's not ours.

 

The passing of time is not what defines whether something is slanderous or not. You're not tarnishing someone's reputation if what they said is true. You're shedding light on what their reputation was.