Jake Virtanen | #18 | RW

[N4ZZY]

4 hours ago, Toews said:

Considering they plan on bringing him back after 2 games regardless of performance I will say it undermines that effect.

sigh....

[Hairy Kneel]

So tonights his first game back against LeHigh should be fun.

[alfstonker]

5 hours ago, Toews said:

Considering they plan on bringing him back after 2 games regardless of performance I will say it undermines that effect.

 

Agreed. I don't see the sense other than it is to see if a lot more mins makes any difference. Having said that it's not entirely fair to judge him on say 18mins in Utica with a different system and new line mates if he again fails to show. He needs a prolonged spell to have any benefit in my opinion.

[Alflives]

23 hours ago, SwedeHockey said:

http://<blockquote class="twitter-tweet" data-lang="en"><p lang="en" dir="ltr">Green on Virtanen : &quot;He will gets lots of ice time for the 2 games &amp; you want to make sure he leaves us with lots of confidence.&quot; <a href="https://twitter.com/hashtag/Canucks?src=hash">#Canucks</a></p>&mdash; NEWS 1130 Sports (@NEWS1130Sports) <a href="https://twitter.com/NEWS1130Sports/status/796731832222056448">November 10, 2016</a></blockquote> <script async src="//platform.twitter.com/widgets.js" charset="utf-8"></script>

TSN 1040 is discussing Botchford's article about the owner getting involved with the whole JV up/down issue.

[Canuck Surfer]

On ‎10‎/‎11‎/‎2016 at 5:46 AM, MJDDawg said:

 

Ah, that's comforting, I guess?

 

Still, troubling that this issue wasn't identified by our scouts with all their research leading into that draft. This potential misfire could be huge for this team for years.

 

I thought he won fastest skater in draft testing. Forwards & backwards?

 

Exhibiting that kind of athleticism does not scream poor workout and training habits...

[MJDDawg]

5 minutes ago, Canuck Surfer said:

 

I thought he won fastest skater in draft testing. Forwards & backwards?

 

Exhibiting that kind of athleticism does not scream poor workout and training habits...

 

True. But it seems that teams work so hard these days to try to identify the non-obvious traits...work ethic, desire...etc before the draft. Not saying Jake's going to bust, but the road to the NHL has historically been littered with kids who had all the tools but then just couldn't cut it.

 

I hope this is just a speed bump at the start of Jakes career and not a sign of things to come.

[Alflives]

1 minute ago, MJDDawg said:

 

True. But it seems that teams work so hard these days to try to identify the non-obvious traits...work ethic, desire...etc before the draft. Not saying Jake's going to bust, but the road to the NHL has historically been littered with kids who had all the tools but then just couldn't cut it.

 

I hope this is just a speed bump at the start of Jakes career and not a sign of things to come.

Good post Dawg.  JV needs to play with an elite passer.  He should be put with the .Twins, and left there.  Hell, he should live with the Twins.  Didn't Crosby live with Mario for a while?  Where the heck is the commitment off the ice from our leaders to mentor?  

[Boudrias]

11 minutes ago, Alflives said:

Good post Dawg.  JV needs to play with an elite passer.  He should be put with the .Twins, and left there.  Hell, he should live with the Twins.  Didn't Crosby live with Mario for a while?  Where the heck is the commitment off the ice from our leaders to mentor?  

Virtanen is capable of a 25-30 second shift while the Twins play 60 at minimum. Putting Virtanen with the Twins is a typical Canuck solution that sets the kid up for failure. He should spend a month in Utica with a recall to check on his progress. If he spends the entire season in Utica I will not be distressed. Whether the Canucks win hockey games or not means little other than maintaining a relatively positive attitude. Movement of players between Utica and Vancouver should be a regular action.

 

Virtanen is becoming a 20 year old scape goat for fans and apparently management who think winning is a priority this season. Absolutely brutal.  

Edited November 11, 2016 by Boudrias

[N4ZZY]

2 hours ago, Boudrias said:

Virtanen is capable of a 25-30 second shift while the Twins play 60 at minimum. Putting Virtanen with the Twins is a typical Canuck solution that sets the kid up for failure. He should spend a month in Utica with a recall to check on his progress. If he spends the entire season in Utica I will not be distressed. Whether the Canucks win hockey games or not means little other than maintaining a relatively positive attitude. Movement of players between Utica and Vancouver should be a regular action.

 

Virtanen is becoming a 20 year old scape goat for fans and apparently management who think winning is a priority this season. Absolutely brutal.  

I understand providing a winning environment for young players. 

But, it's obvious this season is a wash already. and if they don't get their act together by December, it's probably too late to make the postseason. They standings don't change that much after Christmas, right? And things get much tighter starting in January. 

 

[Silky mitts]

31 minutes ago, N4ZZY said:

I understand providing a winning environment for young players. 

But, it's obvious this season is a wash already. and if they don't get their act together by December, it's probably too late to make the postseason. They standings don't change that much after Christmas, right? And things get much tighter starting in January. 

 

Almost a guarantee we wont make the playoffs and hopefully nab a top three pick

[Boudrias]

2 hours ago, N4ZZY said:

I understand providing a winning environment for young players. 

But, it's obvious this season is a wash already. and if they don't get their act together by December, it's probably too late to make the postseason. They standings don't change that much after Christmas, right? And things get much tighter starting in January. 

 

Don't really care whether they make playoffs or not. If they did make it they go out in the first round anyway. For me the priority if player development, Player evaluation and prep for the TDL and the Draft.

[Canuck Surfer]

5 hours ago, MJDDawg said:

 

True. But it seems that teams work so hard these days to try to identify the non-obvious traits...work ethic, desire...etc before the draft. Not saying Jake's going to bust, but the road to the NHL has historically been littered with kids who had all the tools but then just couldn't cut it.

 

I hope this is just a speed bump at the start of Jakes career and not a sign of things to come.

 

I concur / concur & my fingers are crossed.  In a lot of these cases guys were just so gifted, they did not have to have the work ethic.

 

Then their pro career hinged on whether they could develop it?

 

I always bagged on Shinkaruk. For having pee wee Herman arms at his draft. Gave me a sense of foreboding and dread that he took it for granted.  And always believed Gaunce would make it.  Less talented he showed up at the draft combines and had the best fitness scores.  Plus played a coaches game, was coachable. You are right; there is a sense of what is coming to be had?

[Gaudette Celly]

On 11/8/2016 at 0:28 AM, TheRussianRocket. said:

 

How is that in anyway trying to run Jake out of town? It's just the reality and truth. Jake is barely hanging on as a NHLer atm. What's wrong with saying that? Lol

 

On 11/8/2016 at 2:25 AM, Toews said:

Jake is running himself out of town, right down to Utica.

 

No, I mean literally out of town, period.  Any who have followed his prospect thread know that from day one there's been a group of people here that never wanted him drafted, and instead of dealing with the fact he's who we picked they've spent 700+ pages criticizing him, bemoaning the pick, and sobbing about others picked afterwards.  Like with Sbisa and Edler before him, he's the draft pick whipping boy.  That's fine and not saying criticism is undeserved, but it's become obsessive and extremely tiring, like Heffy in the GDTs.

[Bure_Pavel]

So Jake finishes the night with zeros across the board 0 G 0 A 0 Shots and -1. The fact he couldn't even get a shot on net is very worrying. At this rate i would leave him down in the AHL for a while.  

Edited November 12, 2016 by Bure_Pavel

[terrible.dee]

On 11/5/2016 at 5:40 PM, wai_lai416 said:

so basically when you are struggling to get playing time.. almost the last guy on the ice and first guy off.. and people are wondering why the coach doesn't trust him or give him more ice time.. cdc bitching about tryamkin not willing to go for conditioning stint in utica and have no problem with Willie not dressing him in game.. but they are all over Willie for not playing Virtanen more when he's not even putting in the extra effort in practice.. hmmm

Wait a sec

 

Is there any evidence Jake has done anything other than ask to be treated like the high pick he is? I haven't heard of him being lazy in practice or having a bad attitude

 

Personally, I don't belive in the "Treat everyone the same" philosophy. The company has considerable assets invested in Jake and I believe he should be given every chance to pay them back

[Zhukini]

24 minutes ago, terrible.dee said:

Wait a sec

 

Is there any evidence Jake has done anything other than ask to be treated like the high pick he is? I haven't heard of him being lazy in practice or having a bad attitude

 

Personally, I don't belive in the "Treat everyone the same" philosophy. The company has considerable assets invested in Jake and I believe he should be given every chance to pay them back

Dave Tomlinson has noted that there have been a few times this season where Jake has been seen being the last one on the ice for practise, and the first one off it. Almost being late once.

 

if that's not laziness then what is?

[SilentSam]

Jake is better off away from this mess at hand..  better times to come.

[duc_evo]

I think that Jake has a lot of flaws but he biggest strengths are his shot, powerful skating and his physical presence. Once he can put all of that in his NHL self. He will be a force. 

[DeNiro]

He should be there the rest of the season and then reassess at next years training camp.

 

He's not going to get anything out of the NHL this year.

[Bissurnette]

On 2016-11-10 at 0:26 AM, Toews said:

Firstly Marner's play in his own zone is better than Jake's. I watched him for years with the Knights and he was consistently one of the best players on the Knights defensively. Having watched a few games of him in the NHL, that hasn't changed. He is easily one of the better forwards for Toronto defensively. At the moment Jake isn't exceptional defensively, his underlying stats looked good last year because he was sheltered as a rookie. But that's fine, most players develop their defensive games as they grow older.

 

This is a forum is it not? Then you should expect to see some dissension. If we all agreed on everything there would be no point coming here at all. If you can't deal with one person's opinion there are other remedies you can take, like blocking that person's posts. Flaming them so that they will stop though is against board rules and accomplishes nothing.

 

Ehlers and Nylander are far better players than Jake is currently. It is unlikely that changes in the future. Is there a chance? Sure. Would they be doing better here than Jake is? I would bet my house on it. This organization has screwed with the development of Virtanen, that doesn't mean the same would have occurred with either Nylander or Ehlers. Both of them were far more ready to play in the NHL last year than Virtanen was.

 

Actually it seems like the opposite to me, whenever anyone decides to compare Jake with one his peers whether it be Nylander, Ehlers, Larkin, Ritchie etc, people get their panties in a bunch and start flipping $&!# because they can't handle any criticism towards the local kid. But how exactly do we judge Virtanen's performances without some form of benchmark?

 

I haven't watched Marner with the Knights so I can't comment on his defensive play in Junior but he's not better than Jake defensively this year, which is saying a lot because Jake's defensive play is nothing to write home about. Marner gets out-muscled easily and he's too anxious in the defensive zone so he runs around too much. He battles hard on the boards, I'll give him that. Which Leafs games did you watch exactly? I'd love to discuss them with you in detail.

 

I don't want to block him, his posts sometimes make me laugh. But since you're bringing up board rules, let's talk about the one that says we cannot discuss a player's private life. I think it might pertain to this specific thread in some instances.

 

I didn't argue that Ehlers or Nylander are better than Jake now, I said there are countless circumstances that influenced their development and their progress and their respective teams, and we simply don't know how they would have developed here. Who knows, maybe if we picked one of them with our 6th they would have felt a lot more pressure that hindered their progression. Maybe they now feel they got passed on by too many teams and they're playing with a chip on their shoulder that they wouldn't have if they got drafted by us. You just never know which way it would go if circumstances were different. Unless you claim to have omnipotent abilities, then I won't argue with you.
 He's who we drafted over 2 years ago, no point in still being sour about it now.

 

He is his own benchmark, you don't need to compare him to other players. COMPLETELY different players I might add. He took a step back this year, management should have sent him down because of it. You can't blame him for that, I blame management for not sending him that message earlier. Last year he was good for a rookie, he did exactly what he was asked. He was fast and furious on the forecheck and he tried to improve his defensive play.