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Elias Pettersson | Quinn Hughes - Contract Discussion Thread

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Bertuzzipunch

By Bertuzzipunch
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PistolPete13 Canucks First-Line

PistolPete13

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3 hours ago, McBackup said:

If we're being charitable to all sides here, players and management, I think its only fair we give the agent the benefit of the doubt too. He's working for the players. Trying to secure the best possible contracts for them. Its not like he's going to sign the contracts himself or undercut his clients for the sake of the team. He's doing his job.

Everyone is doing their job to this point, hence the protracted negotiations. Eventually a deal will be hammered out, and things will go back to normal.

 

Meanwhile the press is selling subscriptions and newspapers by stirring the pot with rumours, innuendo, and idle speculation. Petey’s in Sweden, now he’s in Vancouver, no he’s in Michigan…….whatever! 
 

Stern Jim, just has to stay the course and block out all the chatter. Get these two fine hockey players signed on the dotted line, at the right price, and into camp and let’s play some hockey. 

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RomanP Canucks Rookie

RomanP

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17 minutes ago, Jester13 said:

Well, as I said, precedents have been set with other players, so really the issue right now is that Benning backed himself into a corner with not leaving himself enough room to sign our two most important players. 

 

The era of team-friendly, build a winning team mentality are over. This new generation of pay-me-now players has arrived. 

I actually disagree on the "backing himself into the corner". I think $16 mil for these 2 players at this stage of their career and development is more than generous. Had he left more money available, the agents wouldn't let him save any of it for other players, they would have tried to squeeze every single dollar. This way, here's the offer, take it or leave it, there's no more money available under the cap and we can only negotiate on the term.

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CanucksJay Canucks First-Line

CanucksJay

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How much cap sapce is remaining with Ferland LTIR?

Not like we can carry Bailey, Dowling and DiGuseppi, and Hunt .  Without Hughes and Hunt, we are already at 7D

As for forwards, without Petterson, Bailey, Dowling and DiGuseppi, we are at 11.  

The guys I named (Bailey, Dowling, DiGuseppi and Hunt) make  3m collectively

Ferland LTIR is 3.5

 

This leaves approx 16.5m minimum (am I right?)  Add in Podz 925k and we are now at 12 forwards, 7 D  and 15.5m ish left to sign Petey and Hughes

 

I'm guessing that the entire amount of cap space left + Ferland LTIR is allotted to sign Petey and Hughes We have over 15m to sign the 2 players

 

That doesnt necessarily mean JB will sign them at that price.  What it probably means is that JB will sign them at that price if the term is right 

My guess is

Petey 8.5

Hughes 6.5

 

Question is, who blinks first on length of contract?

 

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I.Am.Ironman Canucks Second-Line

I.Am.Ironman

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34 minutes ago, Jester13 said:

Well, as I said, precedents have been set with other players, so really the issue right now is that Benning backed himself into a corner with not leaving himself enough room to sign our two most important players. 

 

The era of team-friendly, build a winning team mentality are over. This new generation of pay-me-now players has arrived. 

What other players are you using as comps? 16M between QH and EP is more than enough for them to both sign fair deals.

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CanucksJay Canucks First-Line

CanucksJay

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1 minute ago, I.Am.Ironman said:

What other players are you using as comps? 16M between QH and EP is more than enough for them to both sign fair deals.

Hughes cannot be offersheeted this season

 

WHat happens if the Canucks dont budge and Hughes holds out this season

Can he sign an offersheet next year or do his restrictions roll over again to next year?

 

 

 

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204CanucksFan Canucks Prospect

204CanucksFan

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1 hour ago, DIBdaQUIB said:

Agreed.  Neither are showing the kind of leadership McKinnon has shown.  They say they want to win but then seem to be holding out for contracts that just may handcuff the team from doing just that.  

Mackinnon's contract was considered an overpayment based on what he had accomplished at the time. No one could foresee the kind of bargain it would turn in to. We will all see what kind of "leadership" Mackinnon shows when he has to sign his next contract. If he really is the leader of team as well as the best player I'm willing to bet he's going to want to get paid like it. Especially after watching Makar and Rantanen get over $9 million and Landeskog get $7 million now, I fully expect that Pat Brisson (partner of JP Barry at CAA) will make sure his client is the highest paid player on the team. 8 figures is almost a guarantee.

 

Petey and Hughes are fully entitled to do what they think is necessary to get the best deal they can get and the team is fully entitled to do the exact same thing. I hold no ill will towards either side in this negotiation, they are both doing what they think is best and this will get done over the next week or two.

 

Like I've said before, a fair deal usually means both sides feel like they lost. 

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CanucksJay Canucks First-Line

CanucksJay

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25 minutes ago, RomanP said:

I actually disagree on the "backing himself into the corner". I think $16 mil for these 2 players at this stage of their career and development is more than generous. Had he left more money available, the agents wouldn't let him save any of it for other players, they would have tried to squeeze every single dollar. This way, here's the offer, take it or leave it, there's no more money available under the cap and we can only negotiate on the term.

I absolutely agree.

The conversation has to be about term at this point rather than amount.

My guess used to be that Agency wants them to sign the maximum amount available now and hit UFA first year they are eligible.  However, I did the math below and can see why there might be some issues

 

 

This means team Petterson wants a 8.5m x 4 contract

That leaves Hughes at 6.5m X 5

 

I think the issue could be that Hughes and Agency think this is not enough for a 5 year term as he will most likely be outplaying that contract in 2 years.

 

So they might want Hughes at 6.5m X 2 or even 7m @ 2 years

 

That would then mean while Hughes is an RFA in 2-3 years, Petterson would be a uFA after 4 years @8.5 and the Canucks dont want that.

 

I think Canucks would want something like 8.5m x 6 for Petterson (holding him past UFA) or 6.5m x 2 to keep him an RFA 

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Timråfan Canucks Second-Line

Timråfan

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4 hours ago, JM_ said:

 

its the optics that aren't great. It makes it look like they are holding out together, which seems a bit unfriendly to the team to join forces like that. I do think its the agency behind that as a pressure move, and its going to turn off a lot of the fan base. Which is also something I think the agent wants to promote. 

 

Its very hard for people to try to stay neutral with this stuff. And then there's social media.... 

 

 

I stay neutral because this is between the agents and Benning. 

The journalists play their card and interview family members as shown with Tkachuk and Hughes. Why do fans bother about that? 

Talk about being led to the slaughterhouse willingly. 

And sports today is a money business. I would like to change that but I have no power... 

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Elias Pettersson Canucks All-Star

Elias Pettersson

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2 hours ago, DIBdaQUIB said:

Agreed.  Neither are showing the kind of leadership McKinnon has shown.  They say they want to win but then seem to be holding out for contracts that just may handcuff the team from doing just that.  

Rantanen, Makar and Landeskog didn't have a problem taking every dollar they could yet.  Are they being considered as selfish and non-leaders?

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Jayinblack Canucks Rookie

Jayinblack

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34 minutes ago, RomanP said:

I actually disagree on the "backing himself into the corner". I think $16 mil for these 2 players at this stage of their career and development is more than generous. Had he left more money available, the agents wouldn't let him save any of it for other players, they would have tried to squeeze every single dollar. This way, here's the offer, take it or leave it, there's no more money available under the cap and we can only negotiate on the term.

Agree with this.  If player wants to compete for the cup then dont hold out for more than 10% of the team's cap.

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Zhukini Canucks Third-Line

Zhukini

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4 hours ago, CanucksJay said:

here's a question

 

With the addition of Garland,OEL, Dickinson, Podz, Poolman

 

Another year of development for Hogz and Juolevi

 

Can the Canucks make the playoffs without Petterson and Hughes?

 

Reports that the two sides are far off is not encouraging and to be honest, I have to side with management here.

As a fan with a long term vision for this team, I'm ok to make them sit out for a while until they sign reasonable contracts as team unfriendly contracts will become detrimental in a couple of years when guys that bought in like Horvat and Boeser will look at management and say what the heck?

 

If I thought I was worth 6.5 and I signed for 5.5 to be a team player so that we can field a better team and then young guys on the team who havent really proven enough got paid much more by holding out, I would without a doubt go for max money my second time around.

 

I would also be annoyed at my selfish teammates.

 

If I was another player on the team and Benning holds firm and signs them to fair deals, I would be happy that I bought in and that I can trust my GM to stick with the plan.

 

I dont buy the argument that existing players will be pissed if Benning doesn't get the 2 signed.  Players know market value and if they have selfish teammates, it's not good for team cohesion.

 

 

 

 

No. 

 

The Canucks don't exist in their own bubble.

 

Sure we think we've improved with the players you've mentioned, so do about 20 other fanbases in the league. 

This is a team that will be anywhere from 2-4 in the division and if you subtract the two best players over an 82 game season they drop a lot lower. 

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