Elias Pettersson | Quinn Hughes - Contract Discussion Thread

[tas]

46 minutes ago, Patrik Laine said:

https://www.broadstreethockey.com/platform/amp/2021/6/17/22536138/the-flyers-should-take-a-crack-at-offer-sheeting-elias-pettersson-offseason-philadelphia-hockey

 

I got a bad feeling about this. 

because some random flyers fan thinks the team should offer sheet pettersson?

 

edit: just because it's on the internet doesn't mean it's news. this is the guy who wrote that piece. https://www.sbnation.com/users/eamon615

Edited June 19, 2021 by tas

[Patrik Laine]

Just now, tas said:

because some random flyers fan thinks the team should offer sheet pettersson?

Not the guy who wrote the article. Because it actually makes sense for the rangers and flyers to offer sheet Petey. If we match it hurts us bad with the cap if we let him go it sets the team back years. 

[tas]

1 minute ago, Patrik Laine said:

Not the guy who wrote the article. Because it actually makes sense for the rangers and flyers to offer sheet Petey. If we match it hurts us bad with the cap if we let him go it sets the team back years. 

it makes sense except in reality where it'll never happen. 

[4petesake]

35 minutes ago, Patrik Laine said:

https://www.broadstreethockey.com/platform/amp/2021/6/17/22536138/the-flyers-should-take-a-crack-at-offer-sheeting-elias-pettersson-offseason-philadelphia-hockey

 

I got a bad feeling about this. 

While I won’t say there’s nothing to see here, I wouldn’t waste much energy worrying about this. Since Dustin Penner signed his in 2007 and went to Edmonton there have only been 6 offer sheets signed and all were matched. Even his own agent when asked laughed and said that the chance of him getting an offer sheet was “going to be pretty remote.”

[JM_]

10 minutes ago, tas said:

it makes sense except in reality where it'll never happen. 

NYR offer sheets Petey, then we offer sheet Makar 

[higgyfan]

Philly ought to be very careful in how they proceed.  They have 4 RFAs this year; Sanheim, Partick, Hart and Frost.

 

They are also set to lose a very good dman or FW to the ED. 

 

I don't see creating an even bigger mess by signing Pete. 

[Bell]

15 hours ago, EddieVedder said:

Jagr was more dominant than Ovi.  

Jagr could handle the puck, protect it, dish it and shoot better than almost any player i had ever seen.  

People forget how big of a man Jagr was and so skilled.  He was a true Beast.

[Nucker 67]

No concerns Pettersson or Hughes will sign with other teams. Good character guys.

 

What does concern me is the roster/depth next season with the signed players they have:

 

Miller - Pettersson - Boeser

Pearson - Horvat - Hoglander

Motte - Graovac - Podkolzin

Roussel - Highmore - MacEwen

 

Hughes - Myers

Schmidt - Rathbone

Brisebois - Bowey

Eliot

 

Hopefully Benning can re-sign Lind, Juolevi and Hamonic, and also bring in one or two more 5-6 defensive Ds and a #3C.  

 

 

[86Viking]

2 hours ago, Patrik Laine said:

https://www.broadstreethockey.com/platform/amp/2021/6/17/22536138/the-flyers-should-take-a-crack-at-offer-sheeting-elias-pettersson-offseason-philadelphia-hockey

 

I got a bad feeling about this. 

why? Hughes can'r receive an offer sheet at all, and if a team offer sheets Petey we will match, then we can turn around in a year or 2 and target 1 of their rfa's. Tit for tat scenario

[Patel Bure]

Petey and Quinn on one year dog $&!# deals?

 

Probably a very unrealistic idea on my part but any chance both Petey and Quinn take one year deals at like one million each?  Would I be correct in assuming that one year deals would still lead them to RFA?  
 

The trade off here is that they would take minor deals this year so that we can bring in some help, and then they would get their monstrous 8 year deals next year at full premium market value (9 million).  
 

Next season - Holtby, Beagle, Eriksson, Roussel, Luongo cap penalty, and Spooner will be off the books and so that right there in itself would be enough for both Petey and Quinn for their monster long term deals.

[wallstreetamigo]

50 minutes ago, Patel Bure said:

Petey and Quinn on one year dog $&!# deals?

 

Probably a very unrealistic idea on my part but any chance both Petey and Quinn take one year deals at like one million each?  Would I be correct in assuming that one year deals would still lead them to RFA?  
 

The trade off here is that they would take minor deals this year so that we can bring in some help, and then they would get their monstrous 8 year deals next year at full premium market value (9 million).  
 

Next season - Holtby, Beagle, Eriksson, Roussel, Luongo cap penalty, and Spooner will be off the books and so that right there in itself would be enough for both Petey and Quinn for their monster long term deals.

Never gonna happen. 

 

What if one of them gets a career ending injury? What if their play takes a step back? What if Benning uses all his new cap space signing guys longer than 1 year and leaves himself short to re-sign them next summer?

 

No agent in the world or the nhlpa would support that move. 

 

There used to be actialreasonable second contracts in the nhl. Those days are gone. Thanks Dubas.

Edited June 19, 2021 by wallstreetamigo

[Provost]

2 hours ago, Patel Bure said:

Petey and Quinn on one year dog $&!# deals?

 

Probably a very unrealistic idea on my part but any chance both Petey and Quinn take one year deals at like one million each?  Would I be correct in assuming that one year deals would still lead them to RFA?  
 

The trade off here is that they would take minor deals this year so that we can bring in some help, and then they would get their monstrous 8 year deals next year at full premium market value (9 million).  
 

Next season - Holtby, Beagle, Eriksson, Roussel, Luongo cap penalty, and Spooner will be off the books and so that right there in itself would be enough for both Petey and Quinn for their monster long term deals.

Well they aren’t going to go for that since they can get monster contracts AND decent bridge deals.  If they play for $4-6 million under market price for a year it will take most of the career being overpaid to make up for that missed money.

 

Also, we have extra cap space after next year, but we also can’t be giving out monster contracts then as we need to still be efficient with money.  In subsequent years we will have to re-sign Boeser, Miller, Horvat, Hoglander, and Podkolzin…. As well as paying some top 4D.

[steviewonder20]

5 hours ago, Patrik Laine said:

https://www.broadstreethockey.com/platform/amp/2021/6/17/22536138/the-flyers-should-take-a-crack-at-offer-sheeting-elias-pettersson-offseason-philadelphia-hockey

 

I got a bad feeling about this. 

Been discussed earlier in this thread. No one seems worried. JB and Petey’s agent are already negotiating according to articles I’ve read. This won’t be another TT debacle.

[ilduce39]

Will really be interesting to see where they come in at.  
 

IMO too much credit goes to Gilly and Gilman over the 2011 team’s lower salaries.  Players had their hands slapped by the PA over publicly talking about taking lower deals to ice a strong team.  You need your stars to take a little less to allow a balanced team. 
 

It all starts there. 

[NewbieCanuckFan]

5 minutes ago, ilduce39 said:

Will really be interesting to see where they come in at.  
 

IMO too much credit goes to Gilly and Gilman over the 2011 team’s lower salaries.  Players had their hands slapped by the PA over publicly talking about taking lower deals to ice a strong team.  You need your stars to take a little less to allow a balanced team. 
 

It all starts there. 

Some guys took longer deals and gave up lower average salaries.  It was a compromise rather than a giving up salary for the betterment of the team.  I have yet to see too many veteran deals with this management where they gave out a long term deal where the average cap hit was less than market value .

Edited June 19, 2021 by NewbieCanuckFan

[IBatch]

18 hours ago, EddieVedder said:

Jagr was more dominant than Ovi.  

Jagr could handle the puck, protect it, dish it and shoot better than almost any player i had ever seen.  

Yep.  Ovi is like Anderchyuk in that he scores a lot of his points on the PP.   He is similar to Jagr in the fact he's still playing at a high level in his mid 30's.   Jagr lost two years to lockouts - complete seasons, when he would have scored at least another 70 goals, and of course four years in the KHL.   If he stayed he would have challenged WG for the goal scoring lead.   Like Messier and Howe he padded his stats somewhat via longevity, but unlike Ovi he was the best player in the world for several years when Mario went down.   Hate to say this but to me Ovi isn't much different then Brett Hull, his dad or Bossy, i'd have him as the weakest of the bunch as far as generational players go, below Jagr for sure.   He managed his best work during the dead puck era ... Ovi never had to deal with any of that.   Best part is like i said Jagr is a litmus test for the best of the 90's, 2000's and 2010's.    Imagine what Selanne, or Bure could do in today's game with no obstruction, smaller defenseman and no red line?   Mario and Lindros too for that matter.    Not many D's in the league that could handle these guys ...

Edited June 19, 2021 by IBatch

[Ghostsof1915]

Correct me if I'm wrong. If you are giving up 4 first rounders for an offer sheet. You have to HAVE the four first rounders, and they have to be your first rounders. 

So I don't see any team offering that much to basically miss the first round for 4 years in a row. (If they allow over four year for that). And have the cap space. 

 

 

 

 

[IBatch]

2 minutes ago, Ghostsof1915 said:

Correct me if I'm wrong. If you are giving up 4 first rounders for an offer sheet. You have to HAVE the four first rounders, and they have to be your first rounders. 

So I don't see any team offering that much to basically miss the first round for 4 years in a row. (If they allow over four year for that). And have the cap space. 

 

 

 

 

If they do the level down, what AHO got, that would be a tough decision.   We'd have to match but we'd also be overpaying.    At least QHs can't be offer sheeted, a small tactic that right now keeps the team safe and you can bet JB made sure of that.   Small price to pay for burning a year of his ELC.   A first, second and a third is not worth EP, but EP is also not worth 8.4plus yet either is he?   Offer sheets are A-hole moves.  And AHO moves too lol. 

[ilduce39]

9 minutes ago, NewbieCanuckFan said:

Some guys took longer deals and gave up lower average salaries.  It was a compromise rather than a giving up salary for the betterment of the team.  I have yet to see too many veteran deals with this management where they gave out a long term deal where the average cap hit was less than market value .

https://www.google.ca/amp/s/theprovince.com/sports/hockey/even-nhlpa-corners-kesler-on-pay-cut-contract-comments/wcm/92b41a4f-0ae2-4c12-a13b-ee57083171f6/amp/
 

This was in 2009:

 

It has come to this.
After Ryan Kesler spoke open and honestly to The Province on March 18 to say that it would be in the best interests of his teammates to consider pay cuts so the Vancouver Canucks can remain competitive in an uncertain salary cap climate, the aftershocks were felt across the NHL.
Pundits wondered why Kesler wouldn’t go after every penny when the Canucks can talk contract extension July 1. Industry heavies waded in too and there was even a hilarious suggestion that Kesler’s quotes were taken out of context. The NHL Player’s Association also got involved.
“We talked to Ryan and he regrets some of the comments he made,” said NHLPA executive director Paul Kelly.
This is what Kesler told The Province: “If we’re going to win the Cup, we need guys to take pay cuts. The way the salary cap is now, you really can’t get what you’re worth now if you want to win. Everybody in this lockerroom knows that.”

[Patel Bure]

56 minutes ago, Provost said:

Well they aren’t going to go for that since they can get monster contracts AND decent bridge deals.  If they play for $4-6 million under market price for a year it will take most of the career being overpaid to make up for that missed money.

 

Also, we have extra cap space after next year, but we also can’t be giving out monster contracts then as we need to still be efficient with money.  In subsequent years we will have to re-sign Boeser, Miller, Horvat, Hoglander, and Podkolzin…. As well as paying some top 4D.

Not exactly.   Here is what I had in mind:

 

Reality: (Petey and Hughes sign bridge deals)

Year 1: 6.5-7 million

Year 2: 6.5-7 million

Year 3:  6.5-7 million

 

Total = 19.5-21 million (I’m going to assume that 6.5-7 million AAV cost would be their bridge)

 

My Plan (Petey and Hughes “take ONE for the team)

Year 1: 1 million

Year 2: 9.5-10million

Year 3: 9.5-10 million

 

Total = 20-21 million

 

So basically, under this plan, Petey and Quinn would make up for their first year sacrifice after the 3rd year.  Not only that, but they would 

 

1) Play for a competitive Canucks team as early as this coming season

2) Live the life of their dreams and concurrent market value on the open market after 1 year instead of after a bridge.

 

So essentially,

1) The Virtanen buyout money would mostly go towards Petey and Hughes in its entirety for this coming season (2 million out of 2.5 million), while the freed up Sutter, Baertschi, and Edler money (approximately 13.5 million) can go towards high ticket UFA’s for this off season.  All of a sudden, the idea of throwing big money at Hamilton doesn’t become farfetched.

 

2) A year later, the Eriksson, Roussel, Beagle, Luongo penalty, Spooner, and Holtby money all gets split evenly amongst Petey and Hughes.

 

Miller-Petey-Boeser 

Pearson-Horvat-Hoglander

Roussel-Granlund-Podkolzin

Motte-Beagle-MacEwen

 

Hughes-Hamilton 

Schmidt-Meyers

Rathbone-Fantenberg

 

Demko

Holtby

 

As early as this coming season.

 

10 million for Hamilton + 3.5 for Granlund or whichever 3rd line C.

Edited June 19, 2021 by Patel Bure