Canuck Surfer Posted June 23, 2022 Share Posted June 23, 2022 2 hours ago, NucknAsia said: Sounds like there's a pretty big Rot in Winnipeg Coach quits Schiefle rumours of wanting out Now PLD saying not re-signing No coach what is going on there Well you know; have you had ever been to Siberia Winnipeg in winter! And if you were Aladdin, you could take a magic carpet ride of mosquito's to Grand Beach in summer. Spring is better than Edmonton? Spoiler I lived there 23 years. I am allowed a shot that others may not! It is a better place than made out. A safe clean city, good standard of living. But these ^^ are issues. (I also lived Edmonton. Would prefer Winnipeg TBH) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wai_lai416 Posted June 23, 2022 Share Posted June 23, 2022 25 minutes ago, RWJC said: Run the comparables against players his age and perceived long term value, regardless of position, and you’ll see that that’s where he could arrive at. Laine has had some health and consistency issues, but I bet his next deal comes in around the same $ value. And although Horvat is only 27, that’s another 3 years longer than PMD has had to have proven himself. Again, it’s about long term investment and security in retaining your “foundational” youth. Every team ponies up more than they should when hedging that bet around that asset age demo. so what happened to pay for his performance and not pay for his potential? like we are happy to pay the guy 8mil for 60 points and bank on he will continue to improve which really he's been a consistent 60 point ish guy since he entered and frankly i don't see him being any better.. but cdc was having a debate war on whether or not hughes or pettersson is worth x amount a year and they haven't proven anything yet so we shouldn't be paying for potential. if we are paying PLD 8mil x 8 with his 60 point production.. if ep hits 80 in any of his next 2 years are we going to pay 10+ for his potential? even laine with his consistency issue is a far better producer than PLD.. i don't see how PLD is worth anything the same value as Laine other than the fact he's a centerman.. Laine even with his inconsistency have been better than PLD every single year.. i don't see the love fest some of you guys have for PLD.. he's not even good at faceoff.. almost identical stats to pettersson. if we are paying PLD 8mil? are we going to be paying horvat 8mil+ too? coz he does a lot more than PLD with similar production. i see 0 value in getting a PLD and signing him to 8x8..coz i don't see him ever being much more than a 60 point player.. and i don't know what world is a 60 point player worth 8mil 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Angry Goose Posted June 23, 2022 Share Posted June 23, 2022 Big Buff gave up a ton of money rather than play….poor Winnipeg lol 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CanucksCountry Posted June 23, 2022 Share Posted June 23, 2022 Like the player, won't like the price tag, wouldn't give up anything more than this years 1st and Rathbone, our defense is still a weak spot and much rather spend our assets there instead of our biggest strength Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
R3aL Posted June 23, 2022 Share Posted June 23, 2022 3 hours ago, NucknAsia said: Sounds like there's a pretty big Rot in Winnipeg Coach quits Schiefle rumours of wanting out Now PLD saying not re-signing No coach what is going on there Feel bad for the city / fans seems like chaos though Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RWJC Posted June 23, 2022 Share Posted June 23, 2022 (edited) 1 hour ago, wai_lai416 said: so what happened to pay for his performance and not pay for his potential? like we are happy to pay the guy 8mil for 60 points and bank on he will continue to improve which really he's been a consistent 60 point ish guy since he entered and frankly i don't see him being any better.. but cdc was having a debate war on whether or not hughes or pettersson is worth x amount a year and they haven't proven anything yet so we shouldn't be paying for potential. if we are paying PLD 8mil x 8 with his 60 point production.. if ep hits 80 in any of his next 2 years are we going to pay 10+ for his potential? even laine with his consistency issue is a far better producer than PLD.. i don't see how PLD is worth anything the same value as Laine other than the fact he's a centerman.. Laine even with his inconsistency have been better than PLD every single year.. i don't see the love fest some of you guys have for PLD.. he's not even good at faceoff.. almost identical stats to pettersson. if we are paying PLD 8mil? are we going to be paying horvat 8mil+ too? coz he does a lot more than PLD with similar production. i see 0 value in getting a PLD and signing him to 8x8..coz i don't see him ever being much more than a 60 point player.. and i don't know what world is a 60 point player worth 8mil I hear what you’re saying, and I agree with you. I’m just explaining that this is the format the league operates in. When you have competition from other teams, especially with lower tax hits, there is always going to be a mark up or premium on skilled players who could become, close to or already are top line or considered potentially equatable. My take on PLD at 8 x 8 is because with market inflation you already are and will continue to see salaries escalate especially for younger players. Long term value, as I said, it’s a risk, but to have what could become a core piece of your franchise locked in for term enables you to build around it. And if it doesn’t work out, that term - again a risk - could still be of value to another club who is in a position to take it on. Yeah, it could also be a major anchor, but that is the trajectory of contracts in the current NHL when it comes to valuing/overvaluing youth. Again, just use any of the recent comparables. Brady Tkachuk just received a 7yr/8.2 mill per contract. He had his first season above 60pts this year. He’ll be 23 in September. Your opinion on PLD is totally fair. That said, revisit the trade and what was considered fair value between the clubs. Laine + Roslovic for PLD and a 3rd round pick. That exemplifies PLD’s perceived value between both clubs. He may not have yet performed to a level you think commensurate to an 8x8, but I would not be surprised at all if that’s what he gets, or close to, elsewhere. Maybe not 8 years, maybe 5-6. We shall see. All depends who he goes to and what their needs/contention window, etc might be. Regardless of them playing different positions, I envision his career path as something like an accelerated version of Chris Kreider’s with a little more production. Maybe taking a little bit longer to reach full potential but still being a valued, multidimensional asset for the cap hit along that journey. Going back to his value to our club, if he became our asset I’d offer 8 x 8 knowing full well what the salary structure will be going forward and that EP and QH will be commanding more than that, and rightfully so. If that happens, Bo would become redundant. Hate to say it, but no one knows right now if he will remain with the club when the time comes, and picking up a PLD, at the cost of building the roster in other spots, is a tough move. But being strong in the C position is sooooo important. One thing to remember, he’s just about to turn 24. His best years as a pro are ahead of him and as stated he’s just entering them now. A 23 year old, consistent 60 pt C with size that has an estimated higher ceiling than what we’ve seen yet…yeah, you pay a premium for that. No two ways about it. If you don’t, then you’re not obtaining premium youth unless you develop it from within. That will likely take us a few years, and involve some regression, which potentially results in losing some quality players who think the grass may be greener, and the ability to compete and win, is far better elsewhere come contract time. Essentially exactly what we’re witnessing could be happening in WPG right now. Edited June 23, 2022 by RWJC 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DownUndaCanuck Posted June 23, 2022 Share Posted June 23, 2022 Not sure if I like his character but he's only 23 and the sort of center you win in the playoffs with for sure. A solid 25-30 goal scoring, 60 point, physical center who racks up PIMs like it's no one's business, he's kind of like a younger, bigger, meaner Kesler/ROR. Problem is that spot is basically filled with Horvat, PLD isn't going to play 3rd line center and he's a bit wasted on the wing. He needs to be a top-2 if not top line center on a playoff team one day. The only way I'd think it could work in Vancouver is if we end up moving Miller out and let PLD take 1st line center duties. Is he good enough at the moment for that? Maybe not, but at only 23 he'd fit with Petey and Hughes going forward and bring some much needed size and grit to that young core. Rebuilding on the fly the right way. That being said it'd take a big haul to get him, but if we traded Miller we could surely use those pieces. There's probably a very difficult 3-way trade involving Miller, PLD and any other team to give Winnipeg what they want. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Canuck Surfer Posted June 23, 2022 Share Posted June 23, 2022 Just wait till he's UFA We're not in the business of buying rentals. (Should not be anyway!!!) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rick_theRyper Posted June 23, 2022 Share Posted June 23, 2022 8 hours ago, NucknAsia said: Lol, no chance. They have fan support. Its something in the locker room or management. I kid lol 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
You Mad Bro? Posted June 23, 2022 Share Posted June 23, 2022 I think most Canucks fans wanted to draft him at 5 because most pre draft lists had him available to us. Then Columbus grabbed him at three. I remember being bummed about that. We obviously look Olli Juolevi at 5 instead. The next four picks after us were Matthew Tkachuck(6) Clayton Keller(7) Alex Nylander(8) Mikhail Sergachev(9). McAvoy and Chychrun were available too lol. Canucks at the 2016 draft 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alflives Posted June 23, 2022 Share Posted June 23, 2022 10 hours ago, NucknAsia said: Sounds like there's a pretty big Rot in Winnipeg Coach quits Schiefle rumours of wanting out Now PLD saying not re-signing No coach what is going on there The “Juice Man” cometh? 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
D-Money Posted June 23, 2022 Share Posted June 23, 2022 Canucks were rumoured to want PLD because they had a deal in place to flip him to Montreal for PK Subban. That fell apart when Columbus took him, and Montreal did the Weber trade instead. Dubois wants to get paid in 2 years, when we already have Pettersson and Podkolzin to extend. He’ll cost a lot to acquire, and a lot again to retain. Doesn’t seem to make any sense for Vancouver to pursue him whatsoever. 1 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JM_ Posted June 23, 2022 Share Posted June 23, 2022 Imagine if it was Petey or Hughes saying something like this... the pitchforks and torches would be out on Robson within minutes. 1 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Master Mind Posted June 23, 2022 Share Posted June 23, 2022 I think he's overhyped. Not worth the cost to acquire, nor the cost to extend. Jets should have canned Chevy when the Blackhawks scandal came out. No surprise everyone wants to leave with him being extended. 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tower102 Posted June 23, 2022 Share Posted June 23, 2022 12 hours ago, Rick_theRyper said: pLD was my choice that draft. Just saying. Matthews was my choice that draft. Just saying. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SID.IS.SID.ME.IS.ME Posted June 23, 2022 Share Posted June 23, 2022 Jets probably took him out to JOEY to discuss an extension. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JM_ Posted June 23, 2022 Share Posted June 23, 2022 27 minutes ago, SID.IS.SID.ME.IS.ME said: Jets probably took him out to JOEY to discuss an extension. more likely a deep fried pergoie place. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Elias Pettersson Posted June 23, 2022 Share Posted June 23, 2022 9 hours ago, wai_lai416 said: so a guy career best no better than horvat.. never been better than pettersson.. career best of 60 and 61 points we want to pay him 8mil to be the #1 center?? all of a sudden Miller looks cheap even at 9mil+ PLD had 61 points when he was 20 years old. He’s only turning 24 tomorrow so has lots of time to pass Horvat in terms of production. Horvat is a 2C. PLD can be a 1C. As for Miller, he wasn’t even a top 6 player at 24 years old. So not sure why you are comparing Miller to PLD. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
grandmaster Posted June 23, 2022 Share Posted June 23, 2022 1 hour ago, JM_ said: Imagine if it was Petey or Hughes saying something like this... the pitchforks and torches would be out on Robson within minutes. Agreed and rightfully so. This is not fair for his team and fans. He is basically saying trade me. This is not the sort of player we should chase. He has had too much history with not getting along with where he has been. This guy sounds like a cancer. 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JM_ Posted June 23, 2022 Share Posted June 23, 2022 5 minutes ago, grandmaster said: Agreed and rightfully so. This is not fair for his team and fans. He is basically saying trade me. This is not the sort of player we should chase. He has had too much history with not getting along with where he has been. This guy sounds like a cancer. yeah its not a good look. Pretty much trying to pull a Seth Jones move but a year early. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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